Rank: Forum user
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One of our employees appears to have an axe to grind with the company, he alleges that he slipped over on standing water and has filed a claim against the company which of course he has every right to do.
The case is now in the hand of both parties solicitors and the employee is now back at work while the case rumbles on in the back ground.
The employee is now taking his own photos and videos of the manufacturing plant on his mobile and registering what he sees deemed as dangerous all over the site I can only assume as to give this information to his solicitor to aid or strengthen his case.
We don't have a phone policy on site and lots of people rely on their mobiles but now management are reviewing this policy because of one awkward individual.
A photo or a video doesn't give a true representation of what is actually going on in the plant, we have had HSE inspections in the past and have never had any notifications served against us. Could be paranoid but whats to stop the employee sabotaging parts of the plant to aid his claim?
I can garauntee if I walked around any manufacturing unit in the world with a camera even though it may never had been involved in accidents and had an excellent safety record I could still make it out to look bad and paint a very untrue picture of that facility
Maybe this is a job for HR but I thought I would see if anyone else has had a similar experience, we don't really want to review our mobile phone policy but the guy is making it very difficult
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Rank: Guest
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I very much sympathise while also think that it is curious that you state 'Maybe its' a job for MR' without any mention whatsoever of either what the 'disgruntled' employee's line manager is doing to regulate his behaviour and what his previous record has been like.
Sometimes, employees with superlative records of commitment become so angry and alienated that they behave in the manner you describe. Sometimes, management have made more fundamental errors in selection, performance appraisal and discipliner and/or grievance.
A host of such circumstantial factors determine whether and to what extent a formal warning is approrpriate; before you do anything, however, it's in everyone's interest to establsih the facts associated with the behaviour you outline and for the line manager to attempt to have an intelligent, civilised conversaton with him about it. If that's too much to expect, the employee's socilitor may reasonably advise him that the behavour you describe may be appropriate as part of a legitimate response to unsatisfactory management behaviour.
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Rank: Forum user
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Previous record is not very good if I'm honest, has history of being an awkward customer, no proof but have heard from his coleagues that he failed his FLT refresher on purpose so that he would have less to do in work.
I personally get on with him , think he is a decent enough bloke and I'm also long enough in the tooth not to believe or judge on the strength of work gossip which may contradict my first paragraph but its just to give you an impression
He is more non compliant about his role than most
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Rank: Forum user
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You have an awkward issue on your hands here, I fear and it crosses over many strains of management, not just H&S or HR. You are correct; there is nothing from stopping this employee deliberately spilling water on the floor and taking a picture to substantiate his claim. Suddenly introducing phone restrictions could be construed by his legal team as an attempt to cover up incriminating evidence and is likely ti make things worse.
You should consider the wider picture; the safety performance of the company, how many slips/trips have you had; what is your policy on cleaning spills, etc etc.
If this is robust, you could refute any claim on the basis of the original claim and what you have already said is superfluous; that he has manufacturered situations and that his 'evidence' cannot be used.
As for him taking pictures, you could argue that during his picture taking, he is distracted and not exercising due diligence - which i'm sure his contract of employment requires - and it could be construed as unsafe. At the very least, he is not working when he should be and so this becomes a management issue.
As KieranD mentions, there may be a wider issue than simply the claimed accident. Maybe mention that you've noted his commitment to improving safety and would he like further - maybe intensive - training so that he is better able to identify those areas he is concerned about (tongue firmly in cheek there!)
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Rank: Forum user
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I agree , if his solicitors point out X,Y and Z faults or dangerous occurences which have been photographed on the plant then employee in question could be pulled up for not reporting them
We have a stringent near miss and dangerous occurence policy so if he is spotting them and not telling anyone on site about them but telling his solicitor then he is infact put the safety of other people on site at risk
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Rank: Super forum user
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quote=Mersey]............. if he is spotting them and not telling anyone on site about them but telling his solicitor then he is infact put the safety of other people on site at risk
Mersey, what a ridiculous proposition that is.
If you or your company cannot manage your activities in a safe and satisfactory manner you can't expect to shift responsibility to someone who happens to recognise 'issues' that others fail to see or choose to ignore.
For example, if you drive dangerously and I witness that, it is not my fault that you later cause an accident and through your own negligence hurt someone. In the same way, you cannot blame this guy for safety issues not of his making, just because he is the one that spots them. By seeking to do so you you arre likely to make matters much worse.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Ian - don't forget that if an employee does discover any shortcomings in the employers' safety arrangements he has a legal duty to inform his employer - see regulation 14 of the Management regulations.
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Rank: Forum user
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Mersey agree with you re employer responsibility, might be worth pointing out Reg 14 that employees have a duty under Management Regs to report to Manager or person responsible for Health & safety, of any work situstion he considers to represent a serious and immediate danger to H&S or they consider represents a shortcoming in the employer's arrangement for H&S
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Rank: Super forum user
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Mersey wrote:...The employee is now taking his own photos and videos of the manufacturing plant on his mobile and registering what he sees deemed as dangerous all over the site I can only assume as to give this information to his solicitor to aid or strengthen his case....
Others have covered the H&S and HR side so can I add this:
Do you have any intellectual property (IP) policies in place? I am certain that if I were taking photos and sending them outside of the business then I could be disciplined for breach of IP.
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Rank: Super forum user
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If he/she is taking photographs on private property then you have the right to state to all employees, and other on that property, that the taking of photographs is only to be done after consent has been obtained.
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Rank: Forum user
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Ian.Blenkharn wrote:quote=Mersey]............. if he is spotting them and not telling anyone on site about them but telling his solicitor then he is infact put the safety of other people on site at risk
Mersey, what a ridiculous proposition that is.
If you or your company cannot manage your activities in a safe and satisfactory manner you can't expect to shift responsibility to someone who happens to recognise 'issues' that others fail to see or choose to ignore.
For example, if you drive dangerously and I witness that, it is not my fault that you later cause an accident and through your own negligence hurt someone. In the same way, you cannot blame this guy for safety issues not of his making, just because he is the one that spots them. By seeking to do so you you arre likely to make matters much worse.
What on earth are you talking about? That analogy of yours did it come out of a xmas cracker? you just can't use your comparisson maybe you didn't read the text. Like other posters have correctly pointed out reg 14 Management Regs employees have a duty under Management Regs to report to Manager or person responsible for Health & safety, of any work situstion he considers to represent a serious and immediate danger to H&S
Lets put it another way if you knew of a dangerous situation on a plant for example racking about to collapse in a warehouse what would you do? Take pictures and walk away without warning anyone about the immediate danger? You are missing the point , it may not be his fault that the racking is about to collapse but if he knew it was and failed to inform people of the danger, according to you thats ok?
Very strange
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Rank: Super forum user
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Section 7a of Health and Safety...etc etc states that employees are 'To take reasonable care for the health and safety of himself and others who may be affected by his acts or omissions at work' surely this a basic omission on this employees part? This makes it both a H&S and then HR issue in my mind.
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Rank: Guest
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Mersey,
As available evidence indicates how you conscientiously you exercise the responsibilities of your role and endeavour to grapple constructively with a problem most of us would find v . challenging, may I offer an innovative practical approach?
In 'The New Psychology of Leadership. Influence, Identity and Power', (Haslam, Reicher and Platow,Psychology Press, 2011), the authors make a good case for viewing probelms at work in terms of 'social identity'. That means that you REALLY ARE IN IT TOGETHER, in various degrees.
The story you outline is one where the 'in it together' picture reflects a cultural shift, possibly a breakup, in which alternative lines of thinking and action disrupt the business story. In that sense, Mersey, you have an interesting opportunity to take the action necessary to stimulate cultural renewal. No kidding - a fascinating start to 2011!
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Rank: Super forum user
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Mersey only manages sarcasm in response to my comment on his assertion that someone who notes for their own purposes some 'problem(s)' that might have a safety implication is then in some way *responsible* for that problem.
That assertion is palpably wrong.
Let's turn it on its head. Employee speaks to legal adviser and shows those photos with an explanation of the 'problems'. You will be asked why these problems exist, why you haven't spotted them, dealt with them, allowed them to persist etc.
The allegations might be bull[expletive deleted] - you seem to believe that they are, though you provide no evidence for us to consider if that is reasoned judgement or wishful thinking. If it is bull[expletive deleted], when the time comes you should respond properly and through your employer.
I get the strong impression that someone doesn't like the idea of his safety standards being questioned, challenged or criticised by a fellow employee. Seeking to blame that employee and lay at their feet responsibility for outstanding safety issues is not the way to go.
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Rank: Super forum user
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This issue appears to be one which several management strands need to be addressing: HR, legal, security as well as H&S.
If the employee is finding uncontrolled risks then these need to be sorted out very quickly. If he is manufacturing these risks himself then the appropriate action can be taken by HR/Legal.
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Rank: Super forum user
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I get the feeling that if I poured a bucket of water on my head then rang my solicitor to say that I am working in a factory in the rain and that the roof was missing, that it would take more than a picture of me dripping wet to win a case.
Ian, as usual you seem to take pleasure in being Loki. A serious question was asked and others at least empathised, and offered useful advice. Are you able to do that rather than just poke someone with a metaphorical stick and ask them if it hurts? And if it does, that it is their own fault for not taking prophylactic painkillers?
Very strange indeed.....:)
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