Keeping H&S paperwork such as permits to work - how long for? Options  Watch this topic  Print this topic » Normal Threaded

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mootoppers		#1 Posted : 19 April 2011 15:07:00(UTC)
Rank: Forum user		Hi Does anybody have any guidance or personal opinion on how long to keep items such as permits to work for? The maintenance department currently keep everything 'for years and years and years' and finally want to reduce their fire loading! I have been asked but cannot recall... Many thanks
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TFCSM		#2 Posted : 19 April 2011 15:11:26(UTC)
Rank: Forum user		Why not scan it if you have any doubts?
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mootoppers		#3 Posted : 19 April 2011 15:13:34(UTC)
Rank: Forum user		I would love to do that but have been told that 'the IT system is overloaded as it is' and hence not an option....I like your thinking though!
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Kate		#4 Posted : 19 April 2011 16:13:13(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user		We throw the permits away after a year (unless the permit is associated with an incident).
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wizzpete		#5 Posted : 19 April 2011 16:15:51(UTC)
Rank: Forum user		Have you considered document storage off-site? plenty of companies that offer secure storage and you can then access what you need on request. that is, if you really do need to keep them....
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safetyamateur		#6 Posted : 19 April 2011 16:28:15(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user		Kate's system is the one. If it's associated with an incident, you'll want it available, just in case. If the HSE come in for any other reason, they'll just want to see evidence that you use a system and the documentation used.
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mootoppers		#7 Posted : 19 April 2011 16:29:17(UTC)
Rank: Forum user		kate - thanks for the info. Wizzpete...yes, that's the issue essentially. I think not probably.
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Ron Hunter		#8 Posted : 19 April 2011 23:47:13(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user		Once a Permit is closed, why would you want to keep it at all? Presumably you'll have a #master log# of Permits issued and dates/times closed, with the history of each and every uniquely referenced Permit. That's enough evidence for the Regulators IMHO.
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Wizard		#9 Posted : 24 April 2011 12:14:41(UTC)
Rank: Forum user		Mootoppers, I think you have been given good advice, I can only add that if there is a possible insurance claim by anyone associated with the PTW you would be wise to keep it. No PTW, No insurance claim, or at least the insurance companies use it as a tool to dismiss the claim. I am told that this is a legal document so its worth checking with your legal department. Regards Happy Easter all Wizard
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Wallett27275		#10 Posted : 24 April 2011 16:30:02(UTC)
Rank: New forum user		Hi, I would recommend keeping permit to work forms or copies for three years. They will help you to defend against a possible personal injury claim, should one occur. Once injured an injured party has up to three years to make a claim. I have experience of people attempting to make a claim without even reporting an accident. The closer they leave it to the three years the easier it is to fake as habitual/ practiced claimants know most companies will have lost relevant risk assessments etc after this time. Best regards, Steve
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PIKEMAN		#11 Posted : 26 April 2011 16:19:34(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user		Generally speaking it pays to have a "DOCUMENT RETENTION POLICY". Usual things is that docs are kept 3 years (since this is the period when people can sue under the Woolf rules). However anything that refers to a named individual (eg health monitoring, exposure monitoring etc) should be kept 40 years. In theory I agree chuck PTW after a year or so however, it is always possible that an incident could "come to light" within 3 years - if you have no PTW it would be hard to defend any claim. Hope this helps.
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Ron Hunter		#12 Posted : 26 April 2011 22:51:21(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user		Hmm......how many of us have PTW systems that provide a record of those involved? Closed = chuck it, unless part of an incident investigation.
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Terry556		#13 Posted : 27 April 2011 07:52:10(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user		PTW should be kept for 12 months, as per compliance audits
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Ron Hunter		#14 Posted : 27 April 2011 11:20:36(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user		The only sure and certain way to conduct a 'compliance audit' on PTW systems is to do it in real time. All very well having a box of forms showing all the boxes filled in, but were they filled in at the right time and were the actions behind the signature actually carried out? You have to be there to answer these questions.
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