I did a fire risk assessment this morning, a detached building of three floors used as office accommodation. It is an old building with a central timber staircase - that is the only access to/from the first and second floors. Each of the landings has three of four timber doors opening inward but access is directly into the staircase (no lobby). There is also a half landing with kitchen (kettle, toaster, microwave, fridge etc.) The ground floor has three doors opening into the staircase enclose. None of the doors are FR and some do not have self closers. In my opinion, as it is the only means of escape all doors opening into the staircase enclosure should be FR30 complete with door sets etc. I would like a second opinion from you people out there and, how to go about informing the RP that he requires all those fire doors. Please bear in mind he rents out just two of the offices at present - five offices are unoccupied so not a lot of income being generated at present. I believe this is the first fire risk assessment done for this building?

Foiled again Smurf - one ground and one first. The RP actually uses the second floor himself. I suppose I should have mentioned the premises are owned by a pension fund. Does that make any difference as they probably have lots of money but every penny spent means less pension for all?

I am probably precluded from answering as I am an uncaring or possibly dispassionate or hard hearted Fire Risk Assessor. However, I would deliver the bad news that in the case described, that they should be providing a protected lobby at the first floor or providing smoke control within the stair case. In the case that only the ground floor is currently occupied, I would not be too concerned, but my written recommendations within the FRA would be protected staircase throughout, protected lobby at first floor or smoke control throughout. Ability to finance compliance is not my problem and should not influence my findings. Maybe harsh but fair and keps me out of harms way. Of course, in these more enlightened times, you may well be able to demonstrate the case that the existing doors are capable of restricting smoke and fire spread beyond the time required to effect a complete evacuation based on occupancy, detection/alarm design coupled with fire load, calculated fire growth and fire effluent production versus obscuration, tenability during the required or calculated time required to reach a place of ultimate safety, but hey, as we all know FRA is not rocket science, we only have to follow guidance notes etc, etc. Regards

Self closing doors with 25 mm rebate and calculation of likely time to and degree of smoke obscuration coupled with likely time to incapacitation versus time to escape may well prove no further action is necessary. you still need to demonstrate this by calculation and ra. further detail on fire loading and may be able to advise

L3 system already in place. I agree with closers, the problem is however there is no guarantee that the doors will not be wedged open. That goes for FR doors as well. An open fire door is not a fire door!

It's quite normal for pension funds to invest in property. I wouldn't even take that into consideration, it's the rent he pays that funds the pension schemes.

Hi Chris, No mention of what you have discovered regarding ignition sources, fuel etc... mounds of paper files stacked anywhere... you could also mention lots of timber - non fire retardent as excelent fuel and spread of fire too!

Hi Chris, What sort of building structure is it? I'm imagining a late 19th early 20th century large house? What is the rest of the structure like? If FD30's were fitted would they be the only thing left after 15 minutes?

What is the travel distance from top room to final exit? If it's within 18m (or not far off), with no fire loading in the stairs and with positive self closers (assuming the doors are solid and well fitting with suitable rebates), wouldn't the L3 system be a suitable mitigating control measure? BS5839 suggests a cat M system for small office buildings. So, as a L3 system may even represent detection in every room in a single staircase building, and considering the risk associated with non sleeping occupants in a building they are familiar with - wouldn't this be enough? Of course, it's almost impossible to make any such assumptions blind, as fire loading, layout, general condition of the premises and other matters would need to be considered. But as this is a low risk environment with an OTT detection system, maybe that's enough. As far as occupiers wedging doors; seems to me that as long as the risks associated with wedging (or interfering with any FS measure) has been recorded in the FRA, then it's responsibility of the RP to maintain the measures and not the assessors

I remember being told during my training that the only thing likely to be considered low risk would be an unoccupied concrete building full of wet fish. Personally I would probably class what you have described as normal fire risk

I beleive it's a combination of fuel, sources of ignition, occupancy and complexity of the building. Basically, everything has to be the lowest risk in it's own right before the overall level of risk can be considered as low. Nearly all of mine would be low if it wasn't for a high fire loading.

Chris, I would make the argument for the use of the accommodation stair and support this by way of risk assessment. A2 risk profile will result in a maximum travel distance of 22 metres in single direction. Also don’t forget that rooms with high ceilings are safer than rooms with lower ceilings as they have a greater capacity to hold smoke and delay the time taken to fill with smoke to a level that affects escape. For rooms with high ceilings, it is permissible to increase the travel distance, in the case of period buildings with ceiling heights >3 metres < 4 metres, travel distance can be extended by 5%.

bleve you are a mine of information, thanks for that little gem. In reality and speaking in words of one syllable this building would be empty of people within one minute of the fire alarm sounding, especially with so few occupiers at present. What I am thinking of recommending with regard to the stairway is all doors to be fitted with self closers, no wedges to be used and all occupiers to be instructed in the reasons for protecting the stairway. On discovering fire evacuate the room/s affected and immediately sound the alarm. On hearing the alarm evacuate to the assembly point and take the roll call. On the way out anyone can pick up an extinguisher to carry with them in case they need it on the way down. Ensure someone has called the brigade. Further recommendations for fire drills with the alarm actuated to familiarise everyone with the procedure on operation of the alarm. I haven't finished yet - just awaiting some further info. Thanks again to you all. I think this has been a good little exercise.

Chris, Can I ask if this building has building regs approval from Local Authority i.e maybe change of use? Regards Wizard