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TomLowton  
#1 Posted : 01 July 2011 14:54:34(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
TomLowton

My company occupy an office in a 5 storey managed building and I have asked the landlord's receptionist to show me the current fire risk assessment. She produced what I would consider to be a fire safety audit dated 21st October 2004. It also referred to the Fire Precautions Workplace Regs 1997 & the Fire Precautions Act 1971 . I do know that the FSRRO (2005) is the document that we work to so I asked her if there was a more recent assessment in place. She told me that she has been informed by her superior that the 2004 assessment was valid as long as nothing had been changed since then, despite the company removing all the fire extinguishers from the common areas and escape corridors in recent months.I also informed her that the responsible person should inform us of the contents of the assessment and any findings that we ought to be aware of.

Can I ask those more aware of the current legislation to tell me if the landlord's point of view is correct?

Thankyou.

Tom Lowton
Andrew W Walker  
#2 Posted : 01 July 2011 15:55:26(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Andrew W Walker

No, it isn't.

I would insist that a risk assessment is carried out in accordance with the Fire Safety Order 2005. If fire extinguishers have been removed this should trigger a new assessment under 9 (3) (b) of that order.

http://www.legislation.g...2005/1541/article/9/made

The RA should be reviewed annually, IMO, to satisfy 9 (3).

If nothing is forthcoming, then I suggest a call to the local fire service would not be unreasonable.

Hope this helps

Andy
jwk  
#3 Posted : 01 July 2011 16:48:35(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jwk

Agree with Andy. If nothing really had changed then an old assessment might stand, but removing extinguishers is absolutely a significant material change to fire provision, and demands a fresh assessment, not just a review, which would in turn have to be under current legislation, the Regulatory Reform Order. Assessments have to be reviewed in any event as Andy says, but I think a review could have been carried out without necessarily citing the latest law, provided the review uncovered no significant changes to either the level of risk or the findings of the assessment,

John
messyshaw  
#4 Posted : 01 July 2011 21:53:28(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
messyshaw

Nowhere does the RRO say that FRAs have to be reviewed annually.

This may be good practice, but it aint law, it's more a marketing tool for repeat business by dodgy assessors. The RP should use the findings of the FRA to determine the frequency. (however I am a loss to see how any FRA could justify a 7 year gap between reviews!)

I agree the removal of the FFE would/should constitute a review, in fact I'd argue the review should have preceded their removal
firesafety101  
#5 Posted : 01 July 2011 21:56:37(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

IMO there has been a reviewed fire risk assessment as the fire extinguishers have been removed - it must be assumed that they are no longer required due to a change in the fire risk - or have they been removed to be serviced perhaps? In that case substitutes should have been provided. No that's not what has happened at all has it?

The rrfso suggests that your existing arrangements may be acceptable - if that is the case then you need do nothing, however before you decide that there has to be a new assessment or at least a review of the "old" assessment.

When reviewing the assessment all references to previous Regs should be removed and the assessment should note that it is in accordance with rrfso.

I note you asked the landlord's receptionist - does she have the necessary competence to provide the correct answer?

It appears to me that her superior does not possess that competence.

Make a call to the MFRS at Bridle Road Bootle and ask to speak to the fire safety officer for your area, you will get the correct answer then.

firesafety101  
#6 Posted : 01 July 2011 22:06:19(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

Difficult to say when the review is required. rrfso says "regularly" and if conditions change etc. so don't wait for any changes just do it "regularly".

Now can anyone define that word?
TomLowton  
#7 Posted : 04 July 2011 09:28:35(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
TomLowton

Thank you all for your responses. The RRFSO states that the RP must carryout a risk assessment. So I would expect the RP to do so. If the old assessment under previous legislation is acceptable then I would also expect to see some documentation to state that a review had taken place and the significant findings (if any) written down. I found no such evidence in the file.I would like to cooperate with the RP but I need to be informative and helpful.

Tom
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