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cliveg  
#1 Posted : 08 August 2011 14:33:28(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
cliveg

Good afternoon,

Does your organisation still insist on giving their own driving assessment to all staff who use ordinary low powered plain cars, for example lease cars such as diesel Astras and the like? The question is obviously directed at organisations who have the capability to carry out such assessments.

If so, why, and how does the organisation justify them in these cash strapped times?

The arguement is that if we are asking them to do no more that is required by the ordinary driving test, then shouldn't that be sufficient assessment? Granted there would need to be a check to make sure that they still have a licence!

However, if the HSE are thinking of bringing work related RTCs into the realms of RIDDOR, are those that think there should be additional assessments right?

Thanks

Clive

tomorton  
#2 Posted : 08 August 2011 14:55:55(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
tomorton

We can't assess our car pool and personal drivers ourselves but, like any other employer, we could have it done if justified. Fact is we don't as a matter of routine - we rely on clean licence, valid insurance and MOT etc. and we would review need for more detailed assessment, possibly training or restriction of driving duties etc. only after incident / traffic prosecution / RTC etc.
Bob Shillabeer  
#3 Posted : 08 August 2011 15:56:02(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Bob Shillabeer

This is a very interesting idea with some rather costly methods of dealing with it. The British driving test has been updated over recent years but is only the minimum required to demonstrate driving competence. For example it does not cover motorway driving in practice simply theory. How can a driver be deemed competent say twenty years after passing his/her driving test. If you wish to introduce a company driving test you will need to set down the minimum competency mark and work from there. Have you considered what your insurance company would require you to do before they will continue cover for your employees etc. This is a very difficult area and we must wait and see what both the insurance companies ask for and what the HSE stipulate is the minimum requirement.
Tigers  
#4 Posted : 08 August 2011 16:13:50(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Tigers

Surely this is when competence does come into play. To pass your test you have the knowledge, ability and training, the experience comes with time.
The old addage of "you don't learn to drive until you have passed your test" springs to mind. I wonder is this why so many accidents involve those who have recently passed their test? I would like to see the figures of how many accidents occur in the first year those drivers who passed on their first attempt in relation to those who took longer obviously having more lessons to gain experience.

Could we use psychometric testing (I think that's how you spell it) to test someones attitude to driving safely, could that be transposed into the workplace?
Jackson43327  
#5 Posted : 08 August 2011 16:37:12(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Jackson43327

I would first of all like to cover the issue of justification. If your accident statistic reveal a significant number of vehicle related incidents you will most probably find that the insurance excess for each incident is, when added up very significant which in its self could be sufficent justification for assessing each of your drivers. I have in the past undertaken such a process and in joint agreement with the company insurers and the RAC completed an on-line assessment for all 500 drivers in the company. The on-line assessment will aid in identifying high risk drivers who can then be further assessed and mentored at the wheel by an appointed assessor. You should see reductions in RTCs and subsequently financial savings.
Clairel  
#6 Posted : 08 August 2011 18:40:49(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Clairel

There is no legal requirement to ensure that the employee has anything other than a valid licenece. Right or wrong this is the case even after 20yrs (personally I think everyone should have to retake their test periodically - but that's just my opinion).

The HSE make no further requirement. Most companies annually check driving licences (and if applicable MOT and servicing for their own car) and I would say this should be the minimium requirement.

The HSE along with the Dept for Transport came up with a publicaction about driving at work, which I assume is still free to download from the HSE website.

In an ideal world refresher training / assessment every 3-5 years would be great but a great financial burden so perhaps unrealistic in todays climate.

alexmccreadie13  
#7 Posted : 09 August 2011 07:34:44(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
alexmccreadie13

A few years back I was with a company who brought BSM in to assess all drivers from car to LGV I found it a worthwhile exercise and it reduced our insurance premiums.

If cash was available I would I would try to implement it again as I feel the assessment outlay would be cheaper than the higher insurance premiums and repair costs we are suffering.

Ta Alex
bob youel  
#8 Posted : 09 August 2011 10:40:27(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

Driving especially higher risk kit e.g. Cars [NB;Just how many MEWP's have run down children as against cars having run down children!] should be treated as no different to operating other high risk equipment so employers should do what they can to manage the area as its a crazy situation where a FLT driver operating in a sedate yard has more appraisals in 10 years that does a travelling sales man operating in very high risk areas [as all roads/motorways are!] in their whole life time of driving which could be 40 years!

Many organisations do what they can to try to reduce premiums [1 insurance excess that I personally know of went up from £500 per event to £5K [yes £5k!] in one step last year] inclusive of driving appraisals [IT appraisal in my view is not suitable & sufficient - reality on the road is the way to go!]

Additionally good accident/ incident monitoring systems can pinpoint individuals that need help and/or managing and go a long way to help mitigate claims etc should they come along
JohnW  
#9 Posted : 09 August 2011 11:45:50(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
JohnW

bob youel wrote:
Just how many MEWP's have run down children as against cars having run down children!


Bob, I'm sure you KNOW the answer. In UK there are only several thousand MEWPs, but there's 20 million cars, so the reason is statistics. If there were 20 MEWPs in every UK street I think we'd have more accidents with children. Also MEWP drivers have had training rather than just pass a driving test.

But I do take your point that driver assessment is an area that, well, there is a need, but who has the time?

My last employer, though, did get every company driver go through a RoSPA Driver Development course. But only after we'd had a fatality, a driver at high speed left the M5 and flew into a field, possible mobile phone involved.

I was one of those drivers on the course and I highly recommend the RoSPA course; to this day I still think of it every time I go on a motorway or along a bendy country road. It really did make me 'more aware' and a better driver.

AND my employer also found out (informed by police) that one of their company car drivers was banned 11 months ago!

Those kind of things justify a system of assessment, but for the moment all I offer my clients is a sort of 'Toolbox Talk' for company car drivers which covers a lot of driver subjects (Highway Code, 'clean' car, motorways, accident avoidance etc).


JohnW
cliveg  
#10 Posted : 10 August 2011 18:05:45(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
cliveg

Thanks everyone - real food for thought, knew it was worth asking.

The HSE guide is still available and is worth a read. As ever, the level of investment & training is best determined by risk assessment.

The many comments about long distance motorway travel are spot on. Contacts in the Motorway police are certainly concerned about the hours that commercial drivers spend on the road, and the time pressures they are put under. There certainly seem to be additional risks being introduced to our motorways as a result.

Clive
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