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ctd167  
#1 Posted : 25 April 2012 09:51:14(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
ctd167

As part of our health surveillance process, we require all employee's to complete an annual health declaration which we ask a number of pointed questions, in this case "do you get pins & needles in your hands/arms". One employee has indicated yes and after speaking to him, it would seem the repetitive nature of one particular working task gives him these symptoms. He doesn't see it as a big deal, the symptoms go away when he's not doing the task, and he reckons its not a big enough issue to visit his GP over. Question - Should we INSIST he see's his own GP regarding this issue or arrange for further medical assessment ourselves?
Lawlee45239  
#2 Posted : 25 April 2012 10:00:51(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Lawlee45239

ctd167 wrote:
As part of our health surveillance process, we require all employee's to complete an annual health declaration which we ask a number of pointed questions, in this case "do you get pins & needles in your hands/arms". One employee has indicated yes and after speaking to him, it would seem the repetitive nature of one particular working task gives him these symptoms. He doesn't see it as a big deal, the symptoms go away when he's not doing the task, and he reckons its not a big enough issue to visit his GP over. Question - Should we INSIST he see's his own GP regarding this issue or arrange for further medical assessment ourselves?
If it were me, I would conduct further in-house monitoring over a period of time (depending on the amount of time he is doing the task, e.g. if every day do something like a month monitoring and if once a week perhaps 3 month monitoring), then seek advice from you OH nurse on the matter, and then insist that he is refered to the doctor with a copy of your monitoring findings. Does he have any other conditions? My sister has an issue with her fingers and toes, they are always cold, white (somethimes blue) and she gets pins/needles sometimes, cannot remember the name of the condition, but she doesnt do manual labour, and tends to warp up a lot.
Tomkins26432  
#3 Posted : 25 April 2012 10:16:20(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Tomkins26432

I don't want to play a possible serious issue down but.... it depends on what task is causing the problem and why - I once had a question from a worker who got pins and needles in hands when using a knapsack sprayer, took a look at what he was doing, loosened the shoulder straps a bit and problem solved.
alan w houghton  
#4 Posted : 25 April 2012 10:18:27(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
alan w houghton

Lawlee What you describe could be raynards, my wife has it and is five times more prevalent in women than men. ctd Every task should be HAV assessed and times and duration taken into account this will give exposure levels I would seriously look at what he does on a daily basis and ensure he is monitored because the effects are non reversible Time to act now not when it’s too late
Lawlee45239  
#5 Posted : 25 April 2012 10:30:18(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Lawlee45239

alan w houghton wrote:
Lawlee What you describe could be raynards, my wife has it and is five times more prevalent in women than men. ctd Every task should be HAV assessed and times and duration taken into account this will give exposure levels I would seriously look at what he does on a daily basis and ensure he is monitored because the effects are non reversible Time to act now not when it’s too late
Thats the name of it.
CliveLowery  
#6 Posted : 25 April 2012 10:30:54(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
CliveLowery

CTD, some good advice given regarding the in-house monitoring. It is surprising how some of the simplest, easiest changes to work patterns can have an effect. If you find there is still a problem I would insist the individual attends an appointment with a Occ Health Provider, before it becomes a bigger issue. Good Luck Clive
chris42  
#7 Posted : 25 April 2012 10:37:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

I would say your monitoring system has worked and it is now time for a proper assessment, via your occ Health provider. It will be well worth the money for both you and him. Talk to your provider, who will steer you down the correct route.
sutherlandb  
#8 Posted : 25 April 2012 11:46:13(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Guest

ctd, Can i ask the type of task this individual is carrying out? To answer your question - My answer would be to arrange further assessment to protect both employee and employer.
Ron Hunter  
#9 Posted : 25 April 2012 13:00:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

I understand the disease/ phenomenon to be Raynaud's. Raynard is a popular name for a fox in children's books. If this tingling sensation is directly attributable to a task using vibratory tools and is a frequent task, then you need to be doing more to assess and properly manage the exposure.
ctd167  
#10 Posted : 25 April 2012 13:21:21(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
ctd167

Sutherlandb - The task in question. Operatives use a mechanical punch for putting holes in to fabric. He could punch up to 100 holes at a time, task duration, no more than half an hour at a time, intermitantly, certainly no more than once a day. He's the only operative who experiences pins and needles from this task.
Lawlee45239  
#11 Posted : 25 April 2012 13:28:33(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Lawlee45239

ctd167 wrote:
Sutherlandb - The task in question. Operatives use a mechanical punch for putting holes in to fabric. He could punch up to 100 holes at a time, task duration, no more than half an hour at a time, intermitantly, certainly no more than once a day. He's the only operative who experiences pins and needles from this task.
What is his age? And has he had any previous hand related matters?
JohnW  
#12 Posted : 25 April 2012 16:15:15(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
JohnW

ctd, I'm sure you know, but remember the duration of exposure is like 'trigger time', so is the half hour punching the time standing AT the machine or is it the time ACTUALLY PUNCHING i.e. experiencing vibration? Also in your assessment/questionnaire find out as much as possible about previous employments and the tools used then, as that could be a contribution to any health condition that has developed - you must know that to decide if it is suitable for the employee to continue using vibrating tools. JohnW
Garfield Esq  
#13 Posted : 26 April 2012 23:08:26(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Garfield Esq

ctd167 wrote:
As part of our health surveillance process, we require all employee's to complete an annual health declaration which we ask a number of pointed questions, in this case "do you get pins & needles in your hands/arms". One employee has indicated yes and after speaking to him, it would seem the repetitive nature of one particular working task gives him these symptoms. He doesn't see it as a big deal, the symptoms go away when he's not doing the task, and he reckons its not a big enough issue to visit his GP over. Question - Should we INSIST he see's his own GP regarding this issue or arrange for further medical assessment ourselves?
I would consider a referal to an OHP for a HAVs assessment and general health screening. Alternatively, look at the process that may be causing the issue and reduce the exposure. Monitor for a period, if no improvement refer to OHP.
bob youel  
#14 Posted : 27 April 2012 07:54:25(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

Also remember that we are all different so 1 person out of 10 who are all doing the same job may suffer and v-verse. That's the way of things and that's what makes vibration management so fickle
james fleming  
#15 Posted : 27 April 2012 08:30:58(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
james fleming

I don’t think the ‘option’ of him seeing his own Doctor should be on the table. By all means this is good advice for the person and should they pursue this medical intervention, all good and well. I think the management answer is through the reading of Regulation 6&7 of the Vibration Reg’s. Risk assess the job. Measure the magnitude to which the person is exposed to and if they fall into an action value of 2.5m/s2 (A8) or above you’ll need to look at health surveillance (HS). If you refer the person then you’ll be able to manage the who, why, what, where and how of the HS. You’ll have access to your own occupational health experts diagnosis. From there, you’ll be in a much better position to either advise the employee, protect against long term health damage etc.. That said, they might have been working on vibration kit for so long that even something as little as 1.0m/s2 (A8) sets them off. By reading your first post you have some sort of paperwork HS questionnaire. I wold suggest this is supported/backed up by the occupational health people. So, for me. Insist that he sees your people (occupational health).
chris42  
#16 Posted : 27 April 2012 09:14:09(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

Of course it could also be something not related to work – ie illness such as Diabetes also can cause numbness / tingling in fingers (this is how I found out) and or hobbies they have ( ie keen on DIY, hours playing computer games etc). So seeing his own GP as well as your Occ Health provider may not be such a bad thing. Also a discussion with you about hobbies etc may also prove useful to the company. You may also find as I did with some employees that your Occ health provider may be unwilling / resistant in telling you anything if it is below a certain threshold and or without the persons explicit permission. I had this issue with a national service provider, who was only willing to tell me once the person had what I considered a significant problem.
ctd167  
#17 Posted : 27 April 2012 14:18:19(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
ctd167

Thanks for the input guys, i've now done a couple of things. I've refered the individual for a personal HAVs assessment with our occupational health provider and i've withdrawn him from the activities which gave him the pins and needles till the findings are complete. Here's another question regarding health assessments. Given that they throw up all kinds of information, such as one guy suffers from nosebleeds, another has asthma, another has a dodgy ankle that flicks out of joint from time to time, other operatives taking prescribed medication etc. The question is, should i inform our first aiders of these findings, given the fact that forewarned is forarmed should an incident arise?
Reed21854  
#18 Posted : 27 April 2012 16:33:35(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Reed21854

The problem with sharing information regarding health issues is that any details obtained from GPs, Occupational Health practitioners etc. is covered by the Access to Medical Records Act. You would have to seek the individual's permission to divulge this information.
ctd167  
#19 Posted : 30 April 2012 10:47:22(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
ctd167

I understand that the sharing of information is a minefield, Data Protection Act and all that, but the only info I would divulge is that which is relevant for 1st aid activities, and already documented by the employee on the health surveillance questionnaire anyway. Surely if someone has say a contagious condition, then you are duty bound to inform the 1st aider of the potential risk anyway?
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