Red / Yellow cards are not a black and white issue for me Alan (no pun intended). Depends entirely on the breach; if the red card is of such magnitude then call it whatever you want, but site management are well within their scope to say we can no longer tolerate this individual; however totally agree with you that if the breach can be seen as a simple H&S failing then yes by all means works with the individual and try influence future behaviour. For me the yellow / red card thing is just site management as it has always been (actions=consequences etc) only jazzed up a bit. The danger is; it is often seen as an easy swift site decision when in reality even a yellow card is the first step on the disciplinary process and as such all HR processes must be adhered to.

Alan, This debate could go for ages. As you are probably already aware, most of the United Kingdom Contractors Group (UKCG) run a Yellow and Red card system as do we. I don't have a problem with it personally it is how it is manageed where the problem lies. Example 1. Operative Fails Drug Test, evidence that sample was tampered with as well - fully deserved red card. Example 2. Operative using Chery Picker, been using all week, clipped on etc no problems. Had to get out of basket to move barriers while re-positionning. Momentarily forgot to clip on, basket still only 2ft from ground but travelling - red card. Example 1, we have no problem with, there was no sign of remorse etc, he will almost certainly re-offend given the opportunity. (But not with us) Example 2, guy was absolutely gutted when he realised what he had done, actually reduced to tears, still got a red card. Given the opportunity I doubt he will forget again. However the PC will not allow him to work on any of their sites again. An element of discretion was needed here, unfortunately the Project Manager does not agree and for a momentary lapse someone has got the bullet. A simple re-training session (not induction) as well as a Yellow Warning Card with a time limit would have been far better and would almost certainly have led to a more safety conscious operative. Oh to live and work in a perfect world! Clive

The reason I started this debate was due to have two men red carded One for being on the roof with no edge protection Second chap for being his supervisor Why then not his Manager and their own manager No hearing no debate no behavioural training allowed just kangaroo court Turned up for meeting to busy to discuss manager who arranged meeting did not bother himself as he was too busy sorry feeling bitter towards the whole approach Ray's right we are dealing with grown men with families and mortgages who admitted their mistake and were full of remorse but were not given the chance to change Feel better now

I'm not a great believer in this type of system although I like the Bovis example. It gives the opportunity to change behaviours or they move on after being given a number of opportunities to change working practices. There was an example why it is important to try and change working practices in a post yesterday 'confined space'. If we don't attempt to change peoples thinking around safety then we need to accept that eveytime we leave a site then people will go back to the way they were working prior to us being there.

Red/ Yellow cards end up being very emotive and personally, I don't like to use them, I find a quiet word usually suffices. The problem with guys working unsafely, certainly on a construction site, is not only do they put themselves at risk, there are usually others in the vicinity who are also exposed. On the Bovis site I mentioned in an earlier post, I had cause to have an operative removed from site, not only due to his abusive nature towards myself, but also due to the fact he wouldn't undertake the task he was doing in line with the RAMS in his possession. I approached him twice within an hour, the 2nd time I was physically threatened. Clearly, this man did not see the benefit in the hard work that had been undertaken on his behalf to keep him safe, and in my opinion, never would. So, I red carded him, which meant not only had I kept him safe from his own actions, but others working near him also. I also mentioned that once he was through gate, if he wanted to try to shove the paperwork where he reckoned I should shove it, I was quite willing to let him try!.

Looking at some of the examples here I'd be inclined to say that it's a system that has been introduced with the best of intentions BUT it's open to abuse by those who've got an axe to grind. It also feels like a system that has been introduced without a full understanding or consideration of the potential failings. The other issue is that once the system is abused it will lose credability with the workforce and will be seen as nothing more than a stick to beat them with. Not keen on the idea myself, every workplace needs an effective safety intervention policy but it's essential that it's robust and proven to work.

I believe Balfour Beatty dropped the Yellow/Red card system following a civil claim from an employee who cliamed it breached his human rights. I'm not sure on the exact details but if anyone else could shed some light its an interesting case.

I dont like Yellow/ Red card system. I think it just makes more of a joke of safety, as the guys dont pay any attention to them (in most cases laughing), and dont really care, more often than not if they get a red card they are moved to another site anyway. I like to talk to the guys about it all, highlight what they have done, and what could have happened to themselves or others if the incident had been worse. At present I am having an issue with a Client, they are issuing red cards over not wearing eye protection in the rain, I totally understand where the guys are coming from that they cannot see, but the Client doesnt seem to care about that, their policy is eye protection at all times. FOllowing the issue of a red card the guy and his supervior must attend an induction, which again I dont think is of much use.

Everyone Great comments I am in total agreement that PC's do not come under the same scrutiny this is what I have always found and when it is turned on their head nothing is done Total unfair system and stops as a few have said makes a joke of safety and does not help change behaviour