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decimomal  
#1 Posted : 17 May 2012 15:26:48(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
decimomal

Forgive me for not having the full details, not a good starting point I know, but i am remote from the incident.

The secanrio is a person going into a toilet cubicle closing the ('glass') door behind her, wherupon it shattered, showering her with glass. She was not not badly injured but was shaken up.

I am told that there was no previous sign of damage to the door and that it had not been slammed shut. My initial thouights are that there may be some inherant weakness in the door and that the remaining doors need to be examined. There are no details of the supplier or manufacturer and the question is who do we get to do the examination?

Any ideas?

Ta
Stewart C  
#2 Posted : 17 May 2012 15:58:56(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Stewart C

Hi,

I have had a similar, though not toilet related, experience. Pilkington glass were very helpful at providing help.
One avenue worth exploring during the investigation is, whether the handles had been tightened or fiddled with. A loose handle when tightened without the correct washer can damage the glass and cause it to shatter, some time after the person doing the DIY has left the scene.

Be consoled that at least the toughened glass behaved the way it should and limited any injury to temporary shock.
In a similar accident I investgated, the outcome of the toughened glass shattering led to a severe laceration to an arm caused by some decorative manifestation film holding the shattered glass together and producing a jagged guillotine.

I hope this is helpful.

Regards,

Stewart
CraigEls  
#3 Posted : 17 May 2012 16:05:38(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
CraigEls

Hi,
Your going to need a glass specialist. Had a similar problem with glass panels in Balustrade smashing when apparently nobody was near it. Not sure who the customer contacted but there were loads of ifs and buts involved. Glass should not be in contact with metal such as fixings or clamps must have a rubber gasket as contact with metal can cause vibration transfer etc.
Best get in touch with an expert.
decimomal  
#4 Posted : 17 May 2012 16:16:13(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
decimomal

Thanks for that.

How do I find the expert I need?
A Kurdziel  
#5 Posted : 17 May 2012 16:27:29(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

I have heard of instances of glass shattering like this when it is contaminated with tin. Apparently several large sheets went when they built the Eurostar terminal roof at Waterloo. I think that modern safety glass is generally free of this contamination but older stuff pre 2000 stuff might have it. Ask your glass supplier.
CraigEls  
#6 Posted : 17 May 2012 16:27:53(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
CraigEls

Hi,

As Stewart C mentioned, try contacting Pilkingtons, if its not something they can do direct I am sure they can point you to someone who can help.
Hope this helps.
Ron Hunter  
#7 Posted : 17 May 2012 16:51:22(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

Stewart C's post at #2 should serve as a warning to those considering the "blanket" application of safety film to building glazing, perhaps pending a survey and replacement in an older building.
The application of safety film to a safe glass introduces a significant hazard!
decimomal  
#8 Posted : 17 May 2012 17:02:36(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
decimomal

I spoke to a very nice man at Pilkingtons and he was most helpful. Look up Nickel Sulphide / spontaneous glass breakage on a search engine.

The other likely cause could have been a previous impact.

Thank you for all the replies.
Dazzling Puddock  
#9 Posted : 17 May 2012 17:12:54(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Dazzling Puddock

I am still trying to get my head around the fact that your toilet cubicle doors are made of glass!!
Graham Bullough  
#10 Posted : 18 May 2012 00:47:41(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Graham Bullough

I share Dazzling Puddock's view. Why on earth are doors made of glass (no doubt of opaque or translucent rather than transparent glass!) being specified for toilet cubicles? It's foreseeable that such doors will be subject to numerous knocks and also unintentional stresses, so why use glass even if it is of the sort which breaks in a safe manner. Is it cheaper and/or easier to clean for example than non-glass doors or does its use stem mostly or wholly from an increasing fad or trend among architects and designers?

Also, earlier responses have included some very valid points that the adding of safety film or large stickers for decoration or manifestation to safety glass of the toughened variety may render it hazardous as described.
SimonL  
#11 Posted : 18 May 2012 09:40:51(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
SimonL

Hi
firstly, is there any issue to investigate? If the glass shattered into little squares as toughened glass should then there is no hazard.
Secondly, what is anyone expecting an expert to say? Without having samples of the glass and a site visit to see the exact installation they cannot possibly add anything of value and certainly not anything that you could reliably use.
If the glass was jagged in any way then it's an architect/specifier problem.
Simon
pete48  
#12 Posted : 18 May 2012 11:27:22(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
pete48

A few quick comments on this subject.
Toughened glass is generally 4 times stronger than annealed glass. This makes it possible to, for example, use much thinner cross sections of glass as well it's use in structural applications. These improved properties are gained as a result of the stress profile that is induced in the glass by the toughening heat treatment process. Simply explained, the way the glass is heated and then cooled leaves the glass surface is in compression, while the centre is in tension. This stress profile in the glass is successful as most failures start at the surface from tensile loads. For toughened glass to fail, the applied tensile load must overcome the compressive stress at the surface before the surface can go into tension and fail.
However, toughened glass will break if a static or impact load bends the glass sufficiently to overcome the compressive stress and put the surface into tension and exceed its breaking stress. It can also break when the severe impact of a sharp object penetrates the compressive stresses in the surface. Deep scratches may have this effect and cause fracture when glass is subsequently loaded.
Toughened glass is ( or was when I was involved) manufactured to comply with BS 6206. The standard included a quality test that required a 45 kg leather bag filled with lead shot swung against a test panel from a height of 4 feet (1.2 metres?). The panel must either not break or break safely. For a test panel to break safely, the granules resulting from breakage must be less than xxx size and have sufficiently dulled edges so as to greatly reduce the risk of serious injury. (Not every panel is tested this way of course!)
Thus, provided that the screens were properly specified during construction and correctly installed, there is no obvious reason why they should not be used in this application. Things fail; in this case, it would appear, as designed to do. We should be careful not to limit design by over cautious thinking. OK, a bit of a shock when it goes ‘pop’ but what is the likelihood of failure and the real risk of any injury and how does the overall risk profile compare to other commonly used materials in this specific application?
Many of us, no doubt, have glass shower screens at home and would thus be exposed to the risk of failure of toughened glass every day. It has never worried me and I guess never even entered the mind of most that it could go “pop”.

p48
A Kurdziel  
#13 Posted : 18 May 2012 12:47:12(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

Graham
I as once unfortunate enough to visit a building where the all doors, the mezzanine floor, and a lot of the walls were all made of glass. Most of it was opaque, but shiny. Anybody with eyesight problems could have hated it because of the glare and I don’t know how someone would have managed with crutch or a stick on the slippery floor. The toilets were particularly bad.
It was a brilliant example of design and aesthetics over practicality and safety.
Horrible.
PS yes it was nickel not tin contamination I read about.
SW  
#14 Posted : 18 May 2012 15:33:15(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
SW

I have worked in the glass industry and when toughened glass spontaneously explodes or goes "pop" unexpectedly it comes as quite a shock. Best place to be in this instance is near a WC!!

Float glass is made by floating the molten glass contents on melted tin - maybe that is what you remembered?
p.c.marsh  
#15 Posted : 22 May 2012 15:59:52(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
p.c.marsh

It sounds like glass was chosen for both its' appearance and for ease of cleaning (it is being increasingly used for clinical applications for its' hygiene performance), but in all cases like this there are specific standards that must be met and applied to the different types of glass that could be used in this situation - e.g. BS EN ISO 12543-1 for Laminated glass and Laminated Safety Glass, but I would expect this would be Thermally Toughened Safety Glass (BS EN 12150-1).

There are also standards with regard to impact strength for example.

As some others have suggested, it could have been an inclusion in the glass that has caused failure, or it could be that the glass was not treated correctly on processing or installation.

I work for British Glass (the TA for the industry), but our independent test-house Glass Technology Services ("GTS") does this type of QA, product performance and failure analysis routinely.

Please message me or do a quick search and they will be able to help if you would like to query the quality of the product itself or identify how the glass failed.
decimomal  
#16 Posted : 23 May 2012 16:38:49(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
decimomal

Thank you all for your responses.

Decimo.
grim72  
#17 Posted : 24 May 2012 08:47:48(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
grim72

Just as an aside, I once visited a restaurant in Belgium where all the cubicles were glass but were also see through in one direction - so you could see out while in the cubicle but noone could see in. It was also a shared restroom for both sexes. All a little bizarre, anyway I digress :-) Thankfully none of the panels disintegrated whilst I was in them.
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