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Hospital Boy  
#1 Posted : 30 May 2012 09:16:19(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Hospital Boy

Can anyone help me with this query?

The site where i work has 55 of these chairs, wall mounted. I have just been told that they require a yearley maintenance inspection, as they come under LOLER Regulations.

Is this correct?

All advice / help much appricatied.

Thanks
Safety Smurf  
#2 Posted : 30 May 2012 09:26:46(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Safety Smurf

Not LOLER but given the potential risk of injury in their use I would suggest that yearly maintenance inspection would be prudent.
saferay  
#3 Posted : 30 May 2012 11:19:41(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
saferay

Definitely not LOLER as they are not lifting equipment. They would come under PUWER and should be maintained in accordance with the manufacturers instructions.
NLivesey  
#4 Posted : 30 May 2012 13:31:04(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
NLivesey

Having been digging through the LOLER Regs this week I noticed that there is a section that relates to lifting people (Section 5).

Not sure if there's some kind of caveat that states evac chairs don't fall under LOLER but to my mind they are an appliance that is used for lifting a 'load' (definition includes a person).
Kate  
#5 Posted : 30 May 2012 13:37:09(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kate

Hoists that are used to lift people are lifting equipment. I don't see that the evac chair is lifting equipment. Someone sits in it and it is made to slide (or bump if operated badly) down the stairs - it doesn't do any lifting.

It probably does need unfolding from time to time to check that the unfolding mechanism hasn't stuck. This would be a useful exercise for the people designated to use it in an emergency as it refamiliarises them with how to operate it. Or in fact this check could be combined with a practice exercise in using it.
NLivesey  
#6 Posted : 30 May 2012 14:04:38(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
NLivesey

Kate wrote:
Hoists that are used to lift people are lifting equipment. I don't see that the evac chair is lifting equipment. Someone sits in it and it is made to slide (or bump if operated badly) down the stairs - it doesn't do any lifting.

.

I'm open to being corrected as the Regs state;
Interpretation:
“lifting equipment” means work equipment for lifting or lowering loads and includes its attachments used for anchoring, fixing or supporting it;
“lifting operation” has the meaning given in regulation 8(2);
“load” includes a person;
“work equipment” means any machinery, appliance, apparatus, tool or installation for use at work (whether exclusively or not).

And;

'Reg 8 (2) In this regulation “lifting operation” means an operation concerned with the lifting or lowering of a load.'

Open to challenge on this as my understanding may be a little 'off'.
Kate  
#7 Posted : 30 May 2012 14:11:14(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kate

The chair doesn't leave the ground, so it can't be said to be lowering or lifting its occupant. In its relation to the load it's equivalent to a sack truck. It supports the load without lifting or lowering it.
Safety Smurf  
#8 Posted : 30 May 2012 14:40:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Safety Smurf

LOLER was written to stop suspended stuff falling on people and supended people falling themselves.

Anything else is too wide a translation of the word 'lifting'. Otherwise, crowbars would be lifting equipment.

People need to get the idea out of their head that PUWER is LOLER's poorer cousin, it isn't. The provisions of PUWER are perfectly adequate if the risks have been properly assessed and sufficient controls put in place. including inspection and maintanence.
DP  
#9 Posted : 30 May 2012 14:59:02(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
DP

They do not come under LOLER apply the principles of PUWER as advised by other posters - 55 that's a lot!

I guess this is something you have inherited - has somebody just applied a scatter gun approach to the location of these chairs? I once inherited this issue with no thought going into why they were needed in the 1st instance - I was in a position to remove many via my Fire Risk Assessments much to the embarrassment of the person who had commissioned them a ni on a grand each!

If you want to PM me Ill bell you to go over the problems I had - this may help - far too much for me to type up.

Ron Hunter  
#10 Posted : 30 May 2012 19:14:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

Wow! You need 55 of these? Really? You're going to need a lot of trained people too then!
Bob Shillabeer  
#11 Posted : 30 May 2012 20:38:37(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Bob Shillabeer

In my last job I was asked if we needed any evac chairs to which I said No. The training element is hard to justify in an office environment where there were no disabled employees although one or two did from time to time have difficulty getting round very quickly (myself included because of gout). We took the view that the number was so small and the training costs so high we would evacuate any disabled person by some other means and with safe areas within the fire escape route the risk was minimal, my boss and the exec agreed so we did not have them. The message is horses for courses, but 55 does make the mind boggle a bit.
messyshaw  
#12 Posted : 30 May 2012 20:47:32(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
messyshaw

I think Hospitalboy's username might be a clue why so many are required!!

Bob, the 'by some other means' aspect to the disabled evacuation policy you refer to, do you mean there was another method, or staff would simply improvise on the day?

No criticism intended mate, I am just getting my head around your system.
Hospital Boy  
#13 Posted : 16 June 2012 13:27:26(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Hospital Boy

All,

Thanks for all your replys. My problem now is after some investigation, these chairs, are under NHS regulatory bodies, been classified as a Class 1 medical device, and as such to comply with insurance requirements require yearly servicing by a competent engineer.

I have challenged this.

so that rules out my property maintenance team!!!!

Ron H - yes we have 120 members of staff trained, and also (at their request) trained 30 fire fighters in their use, also the use of ski sheets.(Messy, not LFB!!)

Cheers

HB
Bob Shillabeer  
#14 Posted : 16 June 2012 21:32:19(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Bob Shillabeer

HI Messyshaw, I just picked up on your response to my posting. The environment I work is was not a hospital type workplace but an office covering several floors with three lifts and three fire escape routes. There were no disabled people employed at the time but we did have disabled visitors. Evacuation was not a problem for us so we chose not to provide evac chairs as they required training and practice to use them safely. On the subject of hospitals I have visited our rather large hospital (with about 500 beds with some 25 wards) and have never seen any evac chairs let alone 55. Hospitals have very strict rules about compartmentation and generally have the benefit of close proximity to the fire service. What I was saying is it is horses for courses, where there are a large number of elderly or infirm patients I would argue more for a stricter code on fire prevention than having a large number of evac chairs.
Psycho  
#15 Posted : 18 June 2012 09:41:55(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Psycho

Have a look at changing them for SKI Pads and if you do, make sure you order the washable ones
talking with experiance after we used one to move a patient who spoilt one
the ski pads will do away with the chairs and the ski sheets which will make infection control happier
they used to cost us a fortune for laundering
bring it up at your next NAHFO meeting to see what the other chaps do
we have 3 acute hospitals (1200 Beds) in the trust and we got rid of the chairs years ago
also do you need them if you compartment correctly it may be that you can still use lifts at the other side of the building, unless of course its a 1970s built tower block with lifts in the center and escape stirwells at the corners like my oldest property
messyshaw  
#16 Posted : 18 June 2012 18:19:53(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
messyshaw

I have just developed a system for a very large office building with several thousand occupants. It has 16 separate lift shafts - 6 of which are fire-fighting shafts with fire-fighting lifts.

The disabled evacuation strategy relies on the use of one or more of the 6 fire-fighting lifts as evacuation lift(s). In the unlikely event that all six lifts are defective (bearing in mind, they have all got two independent power supplies) then there will be six evacuation chairs (one for each fire-fighting shaft) as a last resort.

This the easy bit. The most difficult part was training nearly 200 staff members. Then there was changes to the fire detection software (to ensure the FF lifts do not open on a floor where a fire has been detected), adding dozens of signs - and before all of that was possible - convincing management this was a viable option to cover their legislative duties.
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