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riskybizz  
#1 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:01:12(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
riskybizz

Good Morning,

My question is:

Guy turns up for work today claiming he injured his ankle on site on Friday.
Didn't report it to line manager or supervisor.
Now wants to enter it into the accident book.
Any thoughts welcome.

Regards,
Steve
safetyamateur  
#2 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:14:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
safetyamateur

Let him report it. Investigate accordingly.
B.Bruce  
#3 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:16:16(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
B.Bruce

I agree.

Include in your investigation why he thought it was OK not to report an accident at work.
Andrew W Walker  
#4 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:17:08(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Andrew W Walker

Hi Steve
The cynic in me says he did it over the weekend.

Record it in the accident book and investigate accordingly. If there is a policy hat ALL accidents/ incidents should be reported at the time- you could look at a disciplinary as he failed to do it. Witness statements from all and sundry in the area he claims he did it may help to ascertain the true facts. CCTV would be great if you have it.

The bigger cynic in me sees an EL claim on the horizon.

Andy
B.Bruce  
#5 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:20:01(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
B.Bruce

Motorhead - you're so cynical............but like you I think an EL claim is on its way.
riskybizz  
#6 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:21:54(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
riskybizz

Maybe i need to update this part of the H&S policy?



All employees/contractors must report any near miss, accident or injury to the H&S officer or supervisor. Details of all accidents will be entered into the company's accident record book which is kept in the office.

Regards,

Steve
safetyamateur  
#7 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:25:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
safetyamateur

Surprised this isn't already in your policy, risky, and core content of your training but better late than never.

Find out why this guy didn't report it. May well be there's a claim coming but there may also be more you can learn from this incident.
riskybizz  
#8 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:34:10(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
riskybizz




"All employees/contractors must report any near miss, accident or injury to the H&S officer or supervisor. Details of all accidents will be entered into the company's accident record book which is kept in the office."

The above is from the H&S Policy, but should it be more specific as when to report?

sean  
#9 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:36:01(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Guest

Is it cynical Monday today?

This really could be an honest case where the member of staff didn't realise how badly he had injured himself till the following day so has requested the details be entered on to the accident book "just in case" if he genuinely injured himself at work he is following the correct procedure.

Trust seems such a large word?
Andrew W Walker  
#10 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:36:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Andrew W Walker

B.Bruce wrote:
Motorhead - you're so cynical............but like you I think an EL claim is on its way.


Been there before- guy hurt his ankle playing football on a Sunday and turned up on Monday saying he did it on the Friday. He went off work for week or so and put a claim in.

He was caught out and "dealt with" accordingly.

Andy
Andrew W Walker  
#11 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:43:39(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Andrew W Walker

quote=sean]Is it cynical Monday today?

This really could be an honest case where the member of staff didn't realise how badly he had injured himself till the following day so has requested the details be entered on to the accident book "just in case" if he genuinely injured himself at work he is following the correct procedure.

Trust seems such a large word?


If he did, then all well and good. Hence a thorough investigation to find out the facts. If you trust what everyone says at face value there is the opportunity for you to be taken for a very expensive ride.


Andy
Zyggy  
#12 Posted : 02 July 2012 09:47:42(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Zyggy

Let him report it!

Despite anything you may have in your own policies, you cannot refuse anybody reporting an accident as it is their legal right to do so, no matter how long after the event!

I'm with Sean on this one; I have encountered many incidents where an employee has "struggled on" & eventually wanted to make a report.

If it is spurious, then an entry into a BI510 is not an admission of liability (nor is a RIDDOR report!) & any in-house investigation can be appended to the report.

Zyggy
HSSnail  
#13 Posted : 02 July 2012 10:58:49(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
HSSnail

I too am a little cynical - But - I remember many years ago slipping at work (my fist job after finishing Uni) felt very embarrassed and was glad no one saw me. About an hour after I got home the bruising started to come out and within 2 hours my leg was so stiff I could not walk. Had a real job getting it in accident book following day.

So as others have said record and investigate.
riskybizz  
#14 Posted : 02 July 2012 16:39:40(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
riskybizz

I have now done part of the investigation.
The IP had left site via the turnstile and turned his ankle on the path/gravel junction.
His own diagnosis is torn ligaments, resulting in a very swollen and blue/black/purple ankle. (The photo is quite something)
The height difference between the slab/gravel was only 30mm, and quite amazing it could produce such an injury.

Jane Blunt  
#15 Posted : 02 July 2012 16:45:56(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Jane Blunt

riskybizz wrote:
I have now done part of the investigation.
The IP had left site via the turnstile and turned his ankle on the path/gravel junction.
His own diagnosis is torn ligaments, resulting in a very swollen and blue/black/purple ankle. (The photo is quite something)
The height difference between the slab/gravel was only 30mm, and quite amazing it could produce such an injury.



I have known people fracture metatarsals from similar mishaps.

But was it 'at work' if he had left? Or is this area part of the workplace?
pete48  
#16 Posted : 02 July 2012 17:47:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
pete48

Where is the problem? Any employee has the right to report an accident as soon as they are able to do so. A delay across a weekend is hardly unreasonable. Not all injuries are apparent at the time of the event.
The first rule of any professional investigation is not to pre-judge anything but to seek out the facts and then conclude. I believe there is a great risk that if you start with the suspicion that this is a fraudulent or mischevious claim then that is what you will most likely find in your report. I am not suggesting that this is your approach (Riskybizz) but simply pointing out the dangers of following such an approach.
The employee is claiming an accident at work, that is their right and indeed duty. Yours is to investigate and conclude. Then leave it to the lawyers if it comes to that.

If you doubt whether the injury could have been caused as described then you must record that and, if you think you need it, then you should seek further expert opinion to support your opinion as to the invalidity of the events as reported by your employee.

p48
markwarri71  
#17 Posted : 03 July 2012 10:19:56(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
markwarri71

My first post but am trying to keep up with reading the forums and this seemed as good a place as any to start.

Nice one Pete, I think you hit the nail on the head. As humans we are cynical, I have to say I got caught up in this when I read the thread through. However you are absolutely right. As safety professionals we need to follow the process and keep an open mind. If we go in thinking 'this guy is swinging it' we might not be giving him a fair chance and may miss something that could really be a problem.

I think it is right to conclude that we should leave this to the lawyers if indeed a claim does come in. We have the facts, the statements etc. and it is their right if they really were injured at work to receive compensation.
Mr.Flibble  
#18 Posted : 04 July 2012 16:26:49(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Mr.Flibble

It is surprising how many Accidents seem to manifest on a Monday....When your site is judged by how many accident you have (and yes this happens in most if not all big companies) you to tend to challenge the ones that 'seem a bit iffy and develop a cynical side.

I'm not saying don't report or investigate, but you do get a feel after a while for what are genuine accidents and when something is not quite right. I'm all CSI and let the evidence tell the story, just the facts mam and all that, but sometimes you get a feel for these things (and no I wouldnt say that in court).
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