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DaisyMaisy  
#1 Posted : 08 November 2012 00:12:56(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
DaisyMaisy

Hi all, not health and safety question but some of you may have this as part of your package. I am looking at a job that gives the option of company car or mileage. My understanding is that company cars can significantly bump up your tax but they are offering 25p per mile with your own car as an alternative- it will involve travelling over the country to various showrooms - anyone know about the implications of company car and tax?? Any advice appreciated.
johnmurray  
#2 Posted : 08 November 2012 00:20:09(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
johnmurray

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/cars/index.htm

All you need to know: From the people who do know.
Terry556  
#3 Posted : 08 November 2012 07:35:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Terry556

The amount of tax you pay depends on the cost of the car, emissions, for instance you can have a VW Golf TDI which will cost you £40.00 per month on tax, but you will have to pay tax on personal mileage
Quaker  
#4 Posted : 08 November 2012 07:42:40(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Quaker

Don't forget that if you are using your car for business use then you will need to adjust your insurance cover. The standard social domestic and pleasure only covers travel too and from your place of work not between different venues. Additionally with the increased costs I think that 25 pence per mile is not enough.
DP  
#5 Posted : 08 November 2012 08:00:16(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
DP

Is the 25p with a cash allowance for a car too? It usually is. If so then the 25p is not bad al all - alone it sounds very poor.

Currently where I work my grade get a car of cash allowance and both get 15p a mile for company miles

There are other factors to consider if you take the car its new all maintenance is covered - its easy and hassle free.

If you take the cash - you are better off in the long run over a number of years - our company auditor who has crunched the numbers tells me that after 5 years you have a free car……………. This is based on our cash allowance only.
Jake  
#6 Posted : 08 November 2012 08:11:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Jake

Hi Daisy,

The Link John posted will enable you to do the sums. I'll provide a lay persons synopsis and an opinion on when it's worth taking the car.

Essentially a company car is a benefit in kind and the amount of benefit in kind is worked out using the list price of the vehicle and it's CO2 emissions, the more expensive / more polluting, the larger the BIK value. You don't state, but if you get a fuel card with your car (that allows you to use it for person use) the fuel car is also a BIK.

The total value of the BIK for company car + fuel card is provided as a financial figure (it will bein the thousands), this is then deducted from your personal tax-free allowance.

As an example, I have a VW golf and a fuel card and this BIK is roughly £7000, my tax free allowance is therefore in the region of 1250. Therefore depending if you pay 20% or 40% income tax, the actual cost to you for the privilege is 20 or 40% of your BIK value.

Now is it worth it? Consider the costs you would incur yourself if you don't take the car:
- Purchase cost
- Tax
- Insurance
- Repairs / maintenance
- Fuel (if you're given a fuel card for personal use)

I've done the sums for me, and my employer gives you the option of a company car (with fuel card) or no car and no fuel card but £5000 extra salary (and would cover business mileage). Even with this, I'm better off with the car. You’d have to have an extremely generous car cash allowance and do very small annual mileage to make the sums work for the allowance in my opinion.
MrsBlue  
#7 Posted : 08 November 2012 08:37:49(UTC)
Rank: Guest
Guest

I don't have a company car but use my own which is insured through the company's insurance, licence validated yearly etc.

I get 40p per mile.

Rich
martyn  
#8 Posted : 08 November 2012 09:03:59(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
martyn

For people that use their own car for work purposes the Inland Revenue will allow a mileage rate of 45p per mile for the first 10.000 miles and 25p per mile thereafter.

If your employer pays less you can claim the difference though your tax return (but it does mean you will have to make a tax return each year)

I am not sure what difference it makes if your employer also offers a "lump sum" payment in addition to mileage rate.

Hope this helps
David Bannister  
#9 Posted : 08 November 2012 09:12:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
David Bannister

Too many variables Daisy for a definite answer.

The greatest cost of running one's own car from new is depreciation and if large mileages are involved then this becomes even more significant. Personal hire/lease arrangements will impose mileage limits with penalties for exceeding.

25p per mile does not sound enough (on its own) but for a gigantic mileage will become more attractive, taking in to account the above.

I did my own calculation as self-employed and concluded that running my own car and taking the HMRC mileage allowance from by Ltd Co account was better then running a company car and being hit by the personal tax. BUT, that's for my circumstances and others will find the opposite works for them.

A friendly tax accountant will be your best source of advice.
DaisyMaisy  
#10 Posted : 08 November 2012 09:17:01(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
DaisyMaisy

thanks all forn your replies. they are not offering a cash payment for the car if I dont take it but the salary is good would i be better of ft then asking for lower salary and cash payment towards the car?
kevkel  
#11 Posted : 08 November 2012 11:19:19(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
kevkel

Something worth noting when doing your calculations is how often will the car be changed for a new one. As far as I am aware the BIK is based on the list price of the car and does not take into account depreciation. Therefore if you have the vehicle for more than 2-3 years the level of BIK that you pay is proportionally greater than the value of the vehicle. Just something else to think about!
paul reynolds  
#12 Posted : 08 November 2012 13:15:13(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
paul reynolds

Hi Daisy

Take the car and then you can forget about repairs, insurance etc. if you are going to be travelling all over the country it is not worth the hassle and will end up costing you money.

Regards

PaulR
Hutchison43088  
#13 Posted : 08 November 2012 13:27:27(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Hutchison43088

Hi Daisy

I have my own car and like you travel all over the country and get paid 40p per mile. I am thinking about going for a company car as I am at the break point where a company car will become cheaper for myself as I am doing 35k a year. Alot depends on your personal circumstances and what else you need the car for as well as the car you want to have. I spend more time awake in my car than I do at home and I have a young family so I have estate and like my toys in the car so I have a car that I would not be able to get through the company at present but I have asked them to review the list for me.

Best bet is to work out your sums after you have chosen a car you would like and see whats cheaper.
DaisyMaisy  
#14 Posted : 08 November 2012 14:23:47(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
DaisyMaisy

tahnks all for your helpful replies will look into it further as you all suggested. thank you again.
Clairel  
#15 Posted : 08 November 2012 14:29:44(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Clairel

It depends on so many variables.

But if it's 25 pence per mile with no cash lump sum a year vs company car then I would say company car is the way to go, especially if you are doing big mileage.
jfw  
#16 Posted : 08 November 2012 15:40:50(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
jfw

When using your own car, HMRC use the AA car running costs as a basis to calculate the mileage expenses.

http://www.theaa.com/mot...running_costs/index.html

They use the "Total of standing and running costs as pence per mile" for the first 10K miles and then just the "running costs as pence per mile" for anything over 10K miles.

This is where the current 45p and 25p per mile rates come from. If you receive more than this, its regarded as a Benefit in Kind and taxable. (My wife gets paid 46p per mile and gets a P11D every year for about £5).

johnld  
#17 Posted : 08 November 2012 15:44:04(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
johnld

I don’t think anyone else has mentioned it but if you were to have an accident in your own car it could be a write off and insures will only pay book value.

So there would be a big dent in your finances, no pun intended, in order to replace the car.

You do say you will be doing high mileages so it is something ellse to consider
johnmurray  
#18 Posted : 08 November 2012 17:58:18(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
johnmurray

"Don't forget that if you are using your car for business use then you will need to adjust your insurance cover. The standard social domestic and pleasure only covers travel too and from your place of work"

Only covers SDP and travel to a SINGLE place of work. If, as many do, you also have a part-time job, you then need to inform your insurer about that.

And while you are busy extolling the virtues of company car + company insurance, please do not forget your no-claims bonus and the problem you will have with insurance cost if you have no personal car + personal insurance.

If you are using your personal vehicle for work, and with a high mileage, you also NEED to consider servicing and repairs.
If you have a new car, and use it for commercial purposes, you may find that the free servicing clauses with the vehicle are no longer valid.
DP  
#19 Posted : 08 November 2012 19:27:48(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
DP

To clarify, if you have a bump in a company car where company insurance kicks in, then you move on where you'll need private insurance - you may have to declare that bump to your insurers so it may well effect no claims bonuses
johnmurray  
#20 Posted : 08 November 2012 23:37:41(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
johnmurray

DP wrote:
To clarify, if you have a bump in a company car where company insurance kicks in, then you move on where you'll need private insurance - you may have to declare that bump to your insurers so it may well effect no claims bonuses


It will definitely have to be declared on any further insurance.
NCB do not "live" forever and if you drive a car without personal insurance you may well find you are unable to qualify for a NCB, or may only get a smaller one.
Jake  
#21 Posted : 09 November 2012 08:08:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Jake

johnmurray wrote:
DP wrote:
To clarify, if you have a bump in a company car where company insurance kicks in, then you move on where you'll need private insurance - you may have to declare that bump to your insurers so it may well effect no claims bonuses


It will definitely have to be declared on any further insurance.
NCB do not "live" forever and if you drive a car without personal insurance you may well find you are unable to qualify for a NCB, or may only get a smaller one.


To further clarify, the general standard most mainstream insurance companies work to is that you are allowed upto 2 years without using your NCB, after this point it will either not be excepted or a reduction in the number of years NCB based on the insurers in-house standards.

When purchasing private motor insurance you will always be asked if you've had an accident in X years, this would still need to be delcared regardless of the car / insurance arrangements at the time of the accident.

You can gain "NCB" using a company car (a letter from your company confirming how many years without an accident will suffice) but again, if you were to have an accident, then this "NCB" would be lost.
CliveLowery  
#22 Posted : 09 November 2012 09:15:16(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
CliveLowery

Hi Daisy,

This really does depend on your personal circumstances.

Three years ago our company account told the directors that we would all be better off with our own cars and claiming the relevant reliefs etc.

I explained at the time this was not always the case but it fell on deaf ears. At the end of the year and 42K miles later, I showed them how much more having to use my own car had cost me (servicing, tyres, insurance , road fund licence etc) They struggled to get their head round the fact that as I had other income as well, it meant I was almost £9000 per year worse off!

I now have a company car again.

The best advice I can give is get all the information together and go and see an accountant who is qualified to give the advice. It does not cost much but could save you loads.

Good luck in the new job.

Clive
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