Welcome Guest! The IOSH forums are a free resource to both members and non-members. Login or register to use them

Postings made by forum users are personal opinions. IOSH is not responsible for the content or accuracy of any of the information contained in forum postings. Please carefully consider any advice you receive.

Notification

Icon
Error

Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
achrn  
#1 Posted : 20 November 2012 10:44:52(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
achrn


Schools are not my area, but I have been asked to look at and comment on a school's H&S policy and arrangements. I'm not looking for a discussion about professional liability for advice given on a personal basis - please just assume I've got that covered.

I don't really understand how RIDDOR works with respect to pupils. I've looked at HSE edis1 (http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/edis1.pdf) but I'd like more guidance on how you judge whether an injury is "from or in connection with a work activity". The guidance basically says that playground falls won't be reportable, unless they are (which is not terribly helpful). An example of when they would be reportable is "incidents arising because ... the school had not provided adequate supervision, eg where particular risks were identified but no action was taken to provide suitable supervision". But a high proportion of playground incidents could be attributed to inadequate supervision (if you were minded to). Further, if someone (say) falls off some feature or play equipment once, then someone else doing so probably becomes reasonably foreseeable, and the risk should then be identified.

Can anyone point me towards more or better guidance on interpretation of this area?

The other aspect I'm not sure about is the trigger to report incidents "by the quickest practicable means". Someone not at work going to hospital would normally require this, but the edis1 document does not address this, and further says the list of major injuries does not apply to pupils and visitors. The particular reason I ask is that the school procedure (which is apparently lifted from the local authority specimen procedure) only requires a report on an accident within 24 hours, and then someone decides whether it require RIDDOR reporting - and a delay to the next day does not seem compatible with 'quickest practicable means'. I'm confident it's not for eg a teacher - if a teacher suffered a RIDDOR major, then the current procedure is not good enough - but is that how it works for pupil injuries?

Thanks for any pointers to better guidance.

mootoppers  
#2 Posted : 20 November 2012 16:17:17(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
mootoppers

achrn....I feel your pain!

I've gone round in circles with this document (which, believe it or not is a distinct improvement on the last one!)

You're correct on the reporting for pupils....only report if you feel that it is due to a 'lack' somewhere....I return to the 'reasonable' for this judgement - would I as a parent feel that there was reasonable supervision/teaching/conditions/equipment etc and if so, don't report. If unreasonable - report. I also have the fun of having boarding schools as part of my remit, which have lots of 'horseplay' and most definitely not part of the curriculum. Having said that though, as part of the business we look after the pupils out of core teaching hours so we have to make a judgement call on that too for RIDDOR.

To be honest, I have never worried much on the quickest practicable reporting, as I feel that you do need to identify first whether it's due to a shortcoming (which by definition of the guidance you have to) and if so, then you can report. 24 hours seems fine to me.
mootoppers  
#3 Posted : 20 November 2012 16:18:19(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
mootoppers

P.S. meant to say that I've not found anything better on guidance....you just have to ignore the odd 'do we, don't we' conflicting statements!
bob youel  
#4 Posted : 21 November 2012 07:25:18(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

Post me as its a complicated area

A: If a child climbs a drain pipe in the school yard and the pipe collapses because it has not been maintained and the child is taken to hospital because of an injury = Yes. However?

B: If a child climbs a drain pipe in the school yard and falls off where the drain pipe is good and the child falls because of its own action and is taken to hospital because of an injury = No: However?

The word 'however' is the main point here as you need to know all the facts and even then its a 'call'

24 hours in hospital is an area that is almost impossible to apply as a school has no right to find out about a child's hospital stay and many parents will not allow that information to be given out

Phew; that's RIDDOR for you
Invictus  
#5 Posted : 21 November 2012 07:55:36(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Invictus

Bob,

would the pupil be treated as a member of the public and therefore would be reportable for just attending the hospital, the 24 hr rule applies to employee's.

being hurt in Sporting activities would not count as RIDDOR hospital or not unless it was a failure of the equipment.
johnld  
#6 Posted : 21 November 2012 07:57:21(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
johnld

It is not just schools that have a problem with RIDDOR, it is also the Higher Education Sector

When you have over 4500 students living in university managed accommodation within the campus similar problems arise and it’s often a judgment call as to if any accident/ incidents is reportable.

Many universities will also have day nurseries to add to the complications.

Then add the teaching activities which in the sciences which are very hands on.

I could go on but I will say it does make life interesting.
Users browsing this topic
Guest
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.