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Forgive me if I've asked this before but I cant recall if I have or not. One of our key group KPI's is lost time incidents and this performance can play a part in future site investment and development.
We (occasionally) have employees who are using relatively minor accidents to justify having time off work. For example, we had a chap last night who banged his head on a metal frame. The frame isn't an obvious hazard and its not really clear as to how it happened. He just says he was crouched down and as he stood up he caught his head. Nobody saw him do it and he carried on working normally.
This afternoon he should have arrived for work, but he telephoned in and said that he was unwell as a result of the accident and wouldn't be coming in. Now call me cynical but it just so happens that he got paid yesterday and today was his last shift. I know that it very well might be the case that he has developed some delayed symptoms but having investigated the accident and assuming it actually happened as described, the need to take seems totally disproportionate to the accident. And this isnt the first time such a thing has happened. People who are on their last night shift and have a relatively minor cut (for example) then say that they cannot come in to work because the cut is affecting their hand movements.
I have no doubt at all that he'll be back to work after his rest period and he and others are just exploiting the situation to avoid having to work their last night shift. It has even been suggested by a few of the other workers that some individuals are deliberately injuring themselves in order to avoid the last night shift!
I know the first response will be that its a 'cultural problem' but the culture isn't going to change overnight and even then I still feel that we are open to individuals who want to exploit the company who just dont care.
How do others deal with such situations? Its frustrating for me in that I feel powerless to prevent people exploiting the system which has potential negative consequences to everyone else who works on site
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Hi Jason
I have had similar issues in the past which I managed to resolve. To answer the question fully I need a little more information please.
What is the shift pattern? What is the risk profile of the site? Is the site unionised? Is there a claims culture? What sick pay do injured personnel get? e.g. Immediate from the first day of absence. Is injury sick pay different to absence sick pay? Is there full root cause analysis conducted for each injury absence?
Do the line managers conduct the analysis? Do you take part to offer advice and support to the line managers?
Is training conducted to the whole workforce? e,g, H&S awareness and specific related training to all employees, IOSH managing safely for supervisors and managers etc?
Gary
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Rank: Super forum user
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Your employer is OK with people not reporting for work because they 'can't move one of their hands properly'. Really? I suggest there are weaknesses in management as well as culture issues within the workforce. That shouldn't be dressed up as a LTI, rather it should be an unauthorised absence.
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Hi Gary, thanks for taking the time to respond. I'll work through your questions:
1. Shift pattern is 4 on 4 off, 12 hour shifts 2. Risk profile is split. Its relatively low risk manufacturing site but we do have a high hazard solvent based printing department which has 40,000 litres of solvent stored on site 3. Site is partially unionised. A union is recognised but membership is low and the union isnt really active 4. The claims profile isn't too bad and the number of accidents is relatively low (280 employees, 5 lost time, 2 over three/seven day reportables) but when people do have an accident, I'd say there's a 30% ratio of claimants. As with most sites, there are certain individuals who are bolt on claimants. 5. The injury sick pay is dependent on the accident investigation. If we believe we're at fault we'll pay, if not we wont. What I've found though is that if we don't pay the person usually just works overtime to make up the loss or will file an EL claim and recover any loss of earnings that way. 6. Full investigation and root cause analysis is conducted for each accident 7. Line managers usually conduct the investigation with my guidance if I feel they need it or if the severity of the incident is higher, I'll lead the investigation with their participation 8. Supervisors receive IOSH managing safely and we also train employee safety representatives to the same level as we don't have any unionised safety reps.
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ron hunter wrote:Your employer is OK with people not reporting for work because they 'can't move one of their hands properly'. Really? I suggest there are weaknesses in management as well as culture issues within the workforce. That shouldn't be dressed up as a LTI, rather it should be an unauthorised absence. I agree Ron and no, we're not happy with people giving such justification but we've been advised by our HR Manager (I cant comment on the validity of their advice) that we cant take any action against them unless we can prove the accident never happened and we cant force them to attend work as they just self certify their absence.
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Expanding a little, they (HR) also said that we cant discipline employees if we believe they're overplaying an incident because we're not medically trained and if the employee say's they're unfit for work, we have to take them at their word and cannot force them to provide doctors fit notes etc.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Hmmm.........my understanding of employment law was that the employee is bound by contract to attend work when fit to do so. A wee sore hand doesn't stop me getting to work. It's for the employer to determine what useful work can be done by that employee. I think your HR Manager needs the boot.
I could go on a comparative rant about those with real disabilities who report for work everyday..........but I won't.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Jason Part of the issue I can see here is that what you are saying is a little subjective (although I often say the same thing...!) and this will cause HR problems...
It sounds more like a management/HR issue as I wouldn't have called it lost time if he carried on the shift and was obviously fit to do so...ergo...could be fit enough to come in the following day.
I am in a little better position as I am medically trained and have set up regular reviews of OH reports and incidents with HR to look at cases such as this..
Might be an action even if it is case by case rather than quarterly it is a start...if you are looking to fix it for the future.. Drop me a PM if you need more details...
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Rank: Super forum user
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On the other hand....head injuries, even slight, can cause different problems to different people. None should be regarded as inconsequential. You could always have told the employee that he/she would have to be examined by a medical practitioner before restarting work. In a previous incarnation I sustained a deep cut to my head leading to considerable blood loss. I was taken to hospital to have it stitched. The treatment personnel were told by the management rep who took me that he considered it to be a "suspicious injury" and would like to be informed about the treatment and possible cause. He also asked for his request to be confidential. The hospital then gave me the treatment details for my GP with the request printed on it, also the response: that they did not divulge patient details. But then, most managers consider any injury to be deliberate, and time-off to be malingering. Even if the employee is no longer breathing. It goes with the job: Paranoia.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Ron You just wrote that little phrase " bound by contract to attend work when fit to do so". Who decides? You the employer? or the individual concerned? Imagine the no win no fee vultures getting in on this one, if you insisted someone comes to work because you (I presume you are not a Dr specialising in Occupation medicine) as their employer says they have to because in your opinion they are swinging the lead. I have seen someone develop septicemia from a paper staple - a extremely small insignificant wound. A blow to head - no matter how small could lead on to complications. I am not saying your sentiment is wrong by any means, there will always be individuals that milk the system.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Jason
In response to your statements: "but the culture isn't going to change overnight and even then I still feel that we are open to individuals who want to exploit the company who just dont care.
How do others deal with such situations? Its frustrating for me in that I feel powerless to prevent people exploiting the system which has potential negative consequences to everyone else who works on site"
As a constructive alternative to your professed acceptance of disempowerment of your role, may I recommend that you (and your HR colleague) use the Organisational Efficacy Scale to address the cultural challenge you've identified.
All the items of the scale and the ratings for scoring them are published in the Autumn ('Fall') 2010 issue of 'Human Resource Development Quarterly'. Even if you and your HR colleague need the help of a chartered psychologist to use it, it's much more cost-effective than allowing yourself to be as disempowered and frustrated as you say you are. It's also a relatively simple, incisive way of getting to the heart of the problem: not 'overnight' but over 10 - 15 days, which is relatively smart for any radical culture intervention.
An independent professional review of the Organisational Efficacy Scale is also published in the Organisational Efficacy Scale, which you're free to use without charge.
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Rank: New forum user
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My experience has taught me you must manage the person as well as the cause of the accident - I have found that most of single day post injury lost time is not really justified . The main reason people have the odd day off after an accident is because they can or because you let them - the culture of your business/managers is usually the most significant factor. You have to create the enviroment where the expectation is that people attend work rather than take a day off for minor issues. You will need to assess their ability to work safely
You need to address absence pay, how they report the absence to their manager, the content of the return to work interview, the quality and promptness of an investigation, how you manage your KPIs, how the event/absence is escalated to senior managers, how they respond and how the H&S/HR people work together and react to an issue.
My policy is that if someone is off because of an accident then it's serious. I'll go and see them at home to continue the investigation, see if they need help/offer support and ensure they know we take any injury seriously. I'll offer to take a safety rep and/or a manager. I have taken a site leader - it stopped short term post accident absence and it made a seriousy injured person fele that the company really took the accident seriously. I've often come into conflict with HR and the unions over this as some see it as harrassment. However, you can't make a change without challanging behaviour. Your investigation may show the absence is not justified and you may recomend that he is not paid sick pay - you need to be well supported by HR for this (and brave)
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Rank: Super forum user
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Safetybob wrote:
My policy is that if someone is off because of an accident then it's serious.
Absolutely spot on - well done. Tell them they must come in to 'complete the investigation' because 'this is obviously so serious we cannot allow it to happen to anyone else'. If they insist they cannot come in, arrange a taxi, visit at home (as you already say). The 'canteen talk' soon gets around that the firm don't suffer fools easily anymore. Reap the rewards for getting off your bum and actually tackling it. Its too easy to fall into the soft cuddly world of the 'what ifs' being suggested - there will always be a 'what if' What if its a genuine injury and they can't work? - Then you have done your job, nothing more, nothing less, by gathering the facts as part of the investigation. You cannot be criticised for this - under any circumstances.
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Appropriate management of absence has long been a challenge for HR and medical practitioners as well as OSH specialists.
At the same time, there is evidence that addressing the problems arising with attention to cultural and ethical issues ensure that individual employees are held to account fairly for their behaviour, through reasonable peer pressure. Careful attention to cultural and ethical issues enable OSH practitioners to ensure that a minority who attempt to exploit goodwill illegitimately are very rarely enable to outwit or exhaust the collective resourcefulness of thoughtful line managers and colleagues of the OSH folk, without soon risking legitimate exercise of disciplinary measures.
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damelcfc Firstly I do not wish to be disrespectful to your opinions, but I find your approach on the situation heavy handed. Most of what we do as safety practitioners is based on "what if" - we are there to prevent the workforce injuring themselves or being made ill by their work, a proactive approach, not waiting around for the inevitable incident. Accident investigation is important, not acting as judge and jury when someone takes time off because of an injury.
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MEden380 wrote:damelcfc Firstly I do not wish to be disrespectful to your opinions, but I find your approach on the situation heavy handed.
It is indeed heavy handed but achieves the desired results that the OP finds themselves in - I am now in a company that has not had to go anywhere near this kind of 'management' but I was circa 12 years ago. It's an example of another tool in the box - not for all the time and not for everyone but it is there if needed. Lets be brutally honest here (as has been mentioned in other posts many times) if the OP - or others, are in a company who's current KPI pack includes a reduction in LTA's/RIDDORS and failure to achieve this is laid in no uncertain terms at the Safety Managers door (I know, I know, but IT DOES still happen) then he/she will need to take a front foot and not just allow it to become the norm to take time off for anything accident related.
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Rank: Super forum user
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From what I have seen of companies operating similar shift patterns, attendance is usually pretty good. In fact, 'presenteeism' if often more of a problem, where people attend work when not actually fit due to illness/injury. The main reason for this is that someone phoning in at short notice has to be covered by someone who is supposed to be on a night off (or if cover is not arranged the rest of the team have to work much harder). Peer pressure usually works in the company's favour, because most employees don't want to upset their colleagues in this way.
The fact that this is not happening here leads me to think there may be other issues with some or all the employees.
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Quote:The fact that this is not happening here leads me to think there may be other issues with some or all the employees Or the company/management-personel. I don't suppose, by any chance, you have a production quota to meet by end of week ? After all, cr#p management translates to the same attitude in the workforce.
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Jason, firstly a word of caution. Whilst it's commendable to be candid in your appraisal of the situation I'd bear in mind that, if Jason McQueen is your real name, then you need to consider this is a public forum. Just some food for thought.
In terms of the issue? Well, I'd agree with everyone who's mentioned cultural elements need to be considered. We do live in a litigious age but if the workforce feel the success of the company is their success they'll feel less inclined to 'swing the lead'. There'll always be those who will take the opportunity to have a few days off after an accident/incident but there's a lot to be said for positive peer pressure amongst colleagues. The other side of this would also be in relation to accident reduction, so less reports of accidents that may or may not have happened.
I'd also say that the picture you've painted shows HR are dropping the ball on this one and failing in their duty of care to the employees and the company. There needs to be a robust accident follow up and there should be consideration that any LT accident automatically triggers a home visit, both to ensure the wellbeing of the IP as well as to determine if there are duties that they could undertake with sustained injuries. Remember, RIDDOR will still be triggered if they can't return to their normal duties within 7 days, but that's not to say they cannot undertake any task in the workplace. To my mind SafetyBob and DamelFC have got the balance right, it's not heavy handed but rather firm but fair. Where an accident has occurred that results in absence then there is an issue that needs resolution, where that be prevention of recurrence or absence management. I've been involved in a number of post accident home visits most of which were genuine. That said I still remember an event where the 'IP' forgot which body part (and there was only one) was injured when I asked if they would mind showing me the injury.
I'd also add that I'm wary of any accident prevention method that directly aligns KPI's with success. There's always an opportunity to try and explain away why something isn't a lost time accident/RIDDOR. That in itself can promote a culture of under reporting and is counterproductive to a genuine reduction in accidents. Far better to demonstrate an increase in 'near accident/near miss' reporting that then goes to show a genuine reduction in total lost time associated with accidents.
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Thanks for all the replies and I'll try my best to answer the points raised.
We do implement home visits for employees who report absence due to accidents that happened at work and having made such a visit I'm increasingly convinced the person was capable of work but elected no to.
We cant force the individual to come in and work if he has self-certificated his absence and usually the absence is too short in duration to arrange for occupational health meetings. Similarly we cant say 'we don't believe you' because who are we to make that decision not being medically qualified.
So how do we proceed if we believe the employee was capable of working in some capacity but the employee has determined that they cannot? Log it as an unauthorized absence? What then happens if that results in someone being dismissed as it takes them past the final warning stage. As I say, Im not HR practitioner but if the employee has reported the accident (albeit a few hours after the event) but has then self certificated themselves as unfit, I dont think we'd have a strong case.
I think the main problem we have is that if following the investigation, meeting the individual etc we do not believe the injury warranted the time of work, what can we do about it? The feeling is nothing.
I agree that KPI's being linked to accident performance aren't necessarily the best thing but our company is owned by an American parent company and I have no control over the KPI's they set for the site.
I also agree maybe the consequences of short term absence could be increased to dissuade such action e.g. prevention of working overtime in order to make up for the loss in pay but I'm not qualified in HR law to know what we can and cannot do. We do often refuse to pay people for short term absences if we feel they're not genuine as a result of an accident but as I say, this then tends to encourage them to make an EL claim as they know they can recover loss of earnings.
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Dont get me wrong, this isnt a huge problem, it probably only happens two or three times a year but two or three lost time accidents represents about 60% of the total LTI for the site.
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Rank: Super forum user
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If he/she says they are injured/ill and can do no work at all then you should have an arrangement whereby every employee declaring so HAS to present to OccH/HR for assessment before restarting work. That sends a message for a start, it also means you are satisfied that the employee is not going to injure themselves or any others when they do return to work. You could also point-out that it may be necessary to reduce hours worked until satisfied that the injured/ill party is fully fit. Procedures solve problems.
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In a thread headed 'Employees exploiting accidents', it is remarkable how contributions express recommendations proposed in 'The Critical Incident Technique' by John Flanagan in 'Psychological Bulletin', published by the American Psychological Association. Vol 51(4). July 1954.
A twenty-first century style of approach to a problem of this kind is offered in 'Models of Cognition, the Contextualisation of Knowledge and Organisational Theory', by Edward Lorenz in the Journal of Management and Governance, published by Kluwer Academic Publishers. Vol 5 pp. 307-330. 2001
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Sorry Paul, Lost Time Incident. We class anything the loss of a full shift or greater as a lost time incident/accident as a measure of performance below that of RIDDOR reportable accidents.
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