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9Yally  
#1 Posted : 13 December 2012 17:38:53(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
9Yally

Good Afternoon All, Quick question: I have been a H&S consultant for 8 years, hold the NEBOSH General, NEBOSH Diploma and a nationally recognised training certificate. Can I train asbestos awareness in house for my company ? Will I need to meet any requirements for the training to be suitable and sufficient
frankc  
#2 Posted : 13 December 2012 17:58:02(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
frankc

I'd have thought the answer was could you cope with questions asked by the employees regarding Asbestos?
boblewis  
#3 Posted : 13 December 2012 18:29:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
boblewis

The old competence question again. The real question is not what general qualifications you have but what experience and knowledge you have of asbestos and its uses. Trainers need to be competent, see para 139 of acop, and the OP shows no evidence of the practical asbestos experience required. Bob
Ron Hunter  
#4 Posted : 13 December 2012 22:57:16(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

Or the OP may have picked up considerable knowledge and experience over those 8 years, sufficient for the needs of those within the Org. he works for? Yes, the ACoP stipulates relevant experience, but the HSE are also content for awareness training to be delivered via e-learning tools (no interaction, no Q&A etc). A pragmatic approach may be required now and again. Then there's the requirement that refresher training mustn't be a regurgitaion of the initial delivery (And should cover in-house processes, procedures, incidents, investigations, emergency drills, etc etc.). Who better than an in-house qualified trainer to design and deliver that?
bob youel  
#5 Posted : 14 December 2012 08:48:44(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

I would always advise that all practitioners become professionally trained trainers e.g. obtain a Cert Ed or similar as there is more to training than having experience of a subject as things like cognitive, phycomotive and other ways of learning need to be understood as well as the base subject
9Yally  
#6 Posted : 14 December 2012 09:18:52(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
9Yally

Thanks Ron, you answered my question
JohnW  
#7 Posted : 14 December 2012 14:22:41(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
JohnW

9yally, As posters have said it's your knowledge and experience that will say if you are competent to do Asbestos Awareness, but depends on the environment, and, as bob implies, there may be situations where you need certified training. I've doing awareness training for carpenters and folk who hang mirrors in pubs etc. Low risk only. They MIGHT come in contact with asbestos. My training goes as far as explaining the regs, explain the hazard, explaining what the project PC or clients have done re surveys etc., I show them samples and photos, and explain what they should do if they encounter something unusual in a wall or something dusty that might be asbestos; they stop work, they cordon it off, they get the foreman, they might need a shower etc etc, and there's a 20 question test which they must pass 100%. The well-known pub-chain has checked my training module and OK'd it. For the contractor with say 20 employees my 2 hours of 'half-price approved' training is the way to go :o)
boblewis  
#8 Posted : 14 December 2012 14:35:15(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
boblewis

Ron E learning modules prepared by competent trainers though:-) There is a difficult balance here but I am always wary of those who simply ask "Am I competent" to do this or that training where I am not made aware of specific experience in the task/equipment itself. Bob
Clairel  
#9 Posted : 14 December 2012 14:40:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Clairel

I don't think you need awareness of working wiht asbetsos to be able to deliver asbestos awareness courses. For me, being qualified as a trainier should be a pre-requisite for delivering any formal training course. If you then have sufficient knowledge of asbestos issues on top of that then that shouold be enough. The course does not need to be accredited but should meet the guidelines for course content.
boblewis  
#10 Posted : 14 December 2012 19:09:02(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
boblewis

Ah but Claire we were only offered a list of the training achieved not any matters of experience, other than being a consultant. I have to say though that your assertion of some absestos knowledge is sufficient - it really depends on a lot of ifs buts and maybes. I do wholeheartedly agree about recognised Training qualification, with such as PTLLS as a minimum. Bob
RayRapp  
#11 Posted : 15 December 2012 13:12:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

Interesting polarised views - not surprised either. I have given AAT training on many occasions, both internally and externally, although usually the former. I have no asbestos related qualifications and in truth not a lot of experience in dealing with asbestos but, I believe I am competent to deliver basic AAT. Why? I was provided AAT by a very experienced and knowledgeable person and that experience plus general skills and experience of delivering training has helped me to devise a good presentation. Anything can be researched through Mr Google, cut and pasted, a little application is all that is needed. Ye Gods, it's not exactly rocket science!
Kim Hedges  
#12 Posted : 17 December 2012 02:40:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kim Hedges

I have a few certificates myself and recently added asbestos awareness too. I would suggest you get the most recent and basic information, backed up by a piece of paper too. I did mine through: http://www.thetrainingsocieti.co.uk/
RayRapp  
#13 Posted : 17 December 2012 17:04:44(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

Kim, thanks but I don't feel the need to justify providing AAT with a piece of paper which says I am ok to deliver it.
John M  
#14 Posted : 17 December 2012 17:56:29(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
John M

There is another thread - Contractor Competence - that may be of interest to those who provide Asbestos Awareness training pursuant to Regulation 10 CAR 2012. A number of these accreditation outfits will not accept AA training UNLESS it has been provided by a UKATA member. Jobs for the boys no doubt! I have had personal experience of this only last week when an accreditation outfit refused to accept my training notwithstanding that the said accreditation body was spawned decades after I delivered my first AA training course. Our records can show that 305 persons have benefited from our "in house" provisions delivered by competent personnel. So my advice is - carry on delivering if you are competent to do so. If you encounter any difficulties with accreditation outfits please PM me so that I can log details for escalation purposes. Jon
RayRapp  
#15 Posted : 17 December 2012 20:09:05(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

John M There was a lengthy discussion on this forum not so long ago about AAT, UKAT and validity of training. I find it ironic that we have these discussions when in my experience the majority of sub-contractors do not provide AAT at all! Ray
Ron Hunter  
#16 Posted : 18 December 2012 22:08:35(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

Very important to bear in mind that some of these pre-qual schemes may not consider CAR Reg 10 Asbestos Awareness Training AT ALL in the evidence evaluation - an onus remains on those commissioning to ensure the contractor has the necessary specific competencies to do what is required. Unfortunately, the MGC would seem to be promoting /encouraging the UKATA (typ.) route (and furthermore, insisting on regular regurgitation via refresher - contrary to the ACoP) as yet another easy (lazy?) way of complying, saving the bother of considering numerous other equally valid training routes. There is IMHO a danger of the construction industry ending up tied to a very limited number of exclusive closed-shop providers rather than expend a little effort in evaluating equivalence routes. And yet Lofsted and the Government Cabinet Ministers would have us believe that this is somehow the "fault" od the CDM Regulations themselves. Quite bizarre. Of course, those working in Local Government will be aware that procurement law applicable to government bodies does not permit stipulation of such exclusive credentials and we are required (legally obliged) to consider equivalents. We all of us working in Local Authorities, NHS etc. should be aware of this (and failure to follow it is liable to lead to very expensive challenge, compensation payouts or worse). Worryingly, my observations suggest that some public bodies are tending to fall into the MGC trap - a trap that has a very nasty potential bite!
John M  
#17 Posted : 19 December 2012 14:31:07(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
John M

Excellent informative posting Ron. Jon
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