Rank: Forum user
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Hi Guys
I have been contacted by a care home in Scotland that has been told by the Care Commission that it is health and safety law that the emergency cords suspended from the ceiling in disabled toilets need to have the end of the cord laying on the floor. Is this the case and if so what legislation would apply here.
Never heard of this before but I thought that some of you guys in the care industry might be able to shed some light on this
Regards
Robert Paterson
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Rank: Forum user
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I have worked in the industry for 3 years and I have never heard of it,I have however heard many cases of CQC people quoting other examples of Health and Safety law which have no basis in reality,ask the Care Home to ask this person to stipulate under what regulation this is required.
The CQC work on outcomes that Care homes have to meet ,if you go on their site you may find something to help
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Rank: Forum user
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Try these people.
The following is lifted from a DDA guide checklist.
Do you have an assistance alarm within the accessible W.C & does it work? Yes /No
Check that the toilets meet recommended specifications - contact Inclusion Tel 07812034533
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Rank: Forum user
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ps, I have no affiliation with this company, simply aware of them
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Rank: Super forum user
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There is a clear authoritative reference to emergency pull cords in Building Regs Approved Doc M.
Doc M refers to emergency pull cords and requires that they are fitted with two visual markers one at 800-1000mm above floor level and another at 100mm above floor level. There is nothing about leaving anything trailing on the floor!
It seems unlikely that there is any standard that requires this. Hygiene and trip hazards spring to mind. But as they say 'never say never'.
Is it a case that they found the cord strung over something rather than hanging loose from the ceiling fixing? They very often are and that might explain why they have drawn attention to it.
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Rank: Forum user
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Hi Pete.I have used Approved document B in regards to fire but never this one or any of the other Approved documents, the reference could be useful for me in the future ,the CQC people are misleading people who do not have the knowledge to challenge them.
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Rank: Super forum user
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10mark.
B.S. 8300 will also probably have something in it but I don't have access to it in order to confirm this. Perhaps someone with access to the standard will confirm or correct?
p48
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Rank: Super forum user
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8300 says nothing about cords, on, the floor, 100mm from, the floor, was the nearest dimension, plus a comment about an additional low level alarm.
Sorry not really my area, but could get a quick look at the standard.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Just for the joust - Part M can be superceded by any Building Control person who approves a lower stand than the document basic requirements. - Fact
But yes the cord should normally clear the floor by 100mm after all think about what happens to floors and who wants then to handle the soaked cord. Question the CQC person and challenge the points
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Rank: Super forum user
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Could this possibly just be a communication error and what was meant was that someone lying on the floor should be able to pull the cord?
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Rank: Super forum user
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Please refer to :- BS 8300:2009--Design of buildings and their approaches to meet the needs of disabled people – Code of practice.
Clause 12.2 refers to General recommendations for sanitary accommodation
Sub clause 12.2.8 refers to Emergency assistance alarm and it requires amonst other aspects, a pull cord should be reachable from changing or shower seats, from the WC and from the floor.......
Sub -clause 12.6.8 refers to Emergency assistance and it requires amonst other aspects, the emergency assistance pull cord should be sited so that it can be operated from the WC and from an adjacent floor area.
I very much doubt that there are prescriptive requirements in the legislation, but most of the legislation is underpinned by reference to codes of practice, standards etc.
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Rank: Forum user
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Thanks to all who posted. Some useful information that I can go back to the client with
Regards
Robert Paterson
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Rank: Forum user
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“BS 8300:9.3.7.2
An emergency assistance pull cord, coloured
red, should be provided with two red bangles
of 50 mm diameter, one set at a height between
800 mm and 1000 mm and the other set at 100
mm above floor level.”
Cheers
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Rank: Super forum user
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Firesafetybod
As I have said above and elsewhere these are the standards BUT any number of Building Regs approval persons are short circuiting any standards that do exist and permitting lower standards of installation.
It seems in this case that the CQC have interpreted "able to reach from the floor" incorrectly as meaning the cord must be on the floor. I would push a challenge to this right up to the Minister if necessary as the CQC are apparently not competent to inspect these areas.
Bob
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Rank: Super forum user
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My understanding of the 100mm from the floor is to allow for the cord not to be on the floor in case of spillage and to allow cleaning to take place without the cord becoming contaminated. As BobL states the CQC inspector is lacking in their knowledge which is a bit worrying when one of their remits is infection control standards. Challenge the inspector and if not successful raise the matter with their manager.
Take care
John C
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