Welcome Guest! The IOSH forums are a free resource to both members and non-members. Login or register to use them

Postings made by forum users are personal opinions. IOSH is not responsible for the content or accuracy of any of the information contained in forum postings. Please carefully consider any advice you receive.

Notification

Icon
Error

Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
PH2  
#1 Posted : 05 February 2013 15:06:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
PH2

The HSE has published its report on the consultation on revision / abolition of some ACoPs.

http://www.hse.gov.uk/co...ndocs/cd241-analysis.pdf

In the majority of cases respondents agreed with HSE proposal to review / amend the listed ACoPS (usually by a very large majority). I suspect that the majority of forum users would agree with their recommendations.

However the one proposal that was rejected by a majority of respondents (52% of 214 respondents) was L21 - Management of Health and Safety at Work Regs. It is proposed to remove ACoP status and replace it with "guidance". Despite this majority the HSE has decided to ignore the majority view on this fundamental ACoP. It would appear that those opposed to sensible and proportionate health and safety measures (e.g. Daily Wail supporters) have won the day.

PH2
achrn  
#2 Posted : 05 February 2013 15:16:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
achrn

Yes, I read it and thought much the same. Most of the points they say "the majority agreed with the proposal so we'll go ahead", and then there's one glaring "the majority disagreed with the proposal, but we'll go ahead regardless".

It rather made a mockery of the consultation, I thought - where the consultation gives the answer we want, we'll proclaim it supports us, where it doesn't we'll say that consultation doesn't affect the plans.
Ron Hunter  
#3 Posted : 05 February 2013 15:19:45(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

So much for democracy. The ACoP had a few faults, but I'd rather that (and the ACoP status) than a raft of dumbed-down guidance.
I have some sympathy for HSE here - they are not by any measure masters of their own destiny here.

Rumour has it that the HSE will shortly be changing publisher to Ladybird Books.
smitch  
#4 Posted : 05 February 2013 16:28:21(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
smitch

ron hunter wrote:
.
.........I have some sympathy for HSE here - they are not by any measure masters of their own destiny here.........


Absolutely, ever heard of the term “voice of the customer” well if you have then this can be overridden by another term called “the voice of the boss (the one who signs your pay cheque)”

Also on page seven of the document reference is made to the Pressure Systems Safety Regulations 20000 ?????????????? bit premature as they won’t come into force for another 17,987 years.

smitch  
#5 Posted : 05 February 2013 16:33:43(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
smitch

oops should have said page 32 not 7 (opticians on the way home methinks)
NigelB  
#6 Posted : 06 February 2013 15:24:01(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
NigelB

Indeed what a useful exercise this is in the face of 12,000 + people dying from work induced ill-health each year. Consider this in the introduction of the Legionnaire’s Disease ACoP L8:

‘This publication replaces two separate documents: the 1995 Approved Code of Practice and the technical guidance, HSG70. This has allowed information to be consolidated, with the aim of making it easier to read and understand the duties under the law.’

That was in 2000. Now to make it easier for business to understand and comply with their duties, we can split them up again:

‘Consultation proposal: To revise Part 1 of this ACOP and remove Part 2 and make it separately available as revised technical guidance with both to be published by end-2013.’

Full steam ahead!! And this is progress, supposedly.

As regards the Management of Health and Safety at Work ACoP and majority opposition to a proposal, the HSE (Government) have form on this.

In CD 207 on improving worker involvement in 2006 the HSE recorded the following points in their analysis of the responses:

1 HSE question: On making a legal provision for employers to respond to safety representatives.

HSE response:

‘The majority (96%) of those who answered the question favoured a duty to respond, though again employers were less enthusiastic with 72% of those who answered agreeing.’

So with 96% of respondents and 72% of employer organisations in support, the HSE dropped any thought of assisting worker representatives through this proposal!

2 HSE question: On making legal provision for safety reps to be involved with risk assessment.

HSE response:

‘The vast majority of respondents (91% of those who answered) think this new duty would be useful. Of those, 82% also believed that our proposals were practical.’

Employer groups were opposed to it so – naturally – the HSE just dropped the proposal.

There is no substantial evidence that the Management ACoP needs to fundamentally change. And so the flawed, narrowly defined review of health and safety regulation lumbers on!!

Cheers.

Nigel
SP900308  
#7 Posted : 07 February 2013 07:42:13(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
SP900308

Mitch....Classic!
Highlight an error and make an error whilst highlighting it.... Brilliant :)

Sorry, should have read Smitch ;) :) :)
Ron Hunter  
#8 Posted : 07 February 2013 12:31:06(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

On another thread I've suggested the Mr Men series as an alternative to Ladybird Books, with some important qualification:

Just as Enid Blyton's Noddy Books have been 'corrected' since initial publication, so Mr Cameron has decreed (following the commissioning of separate reports that concluded that the opposite was the case) that in order to counteract the "claims culture" so prevalent in the UK several changes will be made to the Mr Men Series:

As a result of (no) consultation (whatsoever) the titles 'Mr Bump' ; 'Mr Clumsy'; 'Mr Wrong' and 'Mr Mischief' are to be immediately discontinued.
With immediate effect, these will be replaced by a simpler, consolidated single book: 'Little MissAdventure'.
Additional print runs of 'Mr Careful' and (of course) 'Mr Perfect' will become available in the next few months.

With apologies to Roger Hargreaves......................
Users browsing this topic
Guest
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.