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I'd struggle to justify sending someone with a splinter to seek proffesional medical assistance but as 1st aiders aren't actually tought how to and it's technically an invasive procedure what should be done?
(by the way, this is theoretical. there's nobody sat here in sufference awaiting your answer)
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In my opinion I would say no.
If the splinter is only minor then the indvidual could remove it themselves (unless it was in a hard to reach area).
If it is larger or more serious then it would probably require medical attention anyway.
There is also the potential for infection either from the splinter or the equipment used for removal. (Although my mother just used to use a pin and tweezers and it never did me any harm)
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Agree with Paulw
Having completed a first aid course last week, we were told not to remove anything, in case it's stuck in an artery, and removing it could cause a serious bleed.
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You could always send them home to their mums, who will sterilise the needle with a lit match, then lick the end of the needle to check it's cold and then open a hole up and then squeeze as hard as they can to get it out.
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If you can use tweezers why not
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hmmmm
I'm meant to be an instructor and I say....
Do you have too?
If they can remove it themselves - let them crack on
If I know them; I'd remove it as friend (Depends where it and how well I know them of course ;) )
If it is easily reachable with tweezers - why not? (Ducks awaiting an array of - they might die and it's now your fault comments)
I would not - start digging around with a needle - or shaving the area with a razor blade (a Dr removed loads of sea anemone spines from my hand like this!)
If it's not easy to remove - cover it with a plaster (to prevent infection) and tell them to man up... and no plasters aren't banned ( until the new plasters act 2013) :)
Also to comment on the above - if it's big enough to be able to cause an arterial bleed I would not call it a splinter - more like the actual stake!...
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Sorry Terry - I quoted your name to credit you with the why not comment - but edited you by mistake - doh!
Credit here instead...
Also I wouldn't remove one from an eye...
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I was thinking from more of a litigious aspect when I answered initially.
In my personal opinion you should be able to remove a minor splinter as a first aider.
My advice from a professional aspect would be to not do so because, should the area become infected and problems arise, it would propbably open a can of (legal) worms.
No I dont agree this is correct, but it is (sadly) a reflection on the nature of the profession in these times.
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paulw71 wrote:I was thinking from more of a litigious aspect when I answered initially.
In my personal opinion you should be able to remove a minor splinter as a first aider.
My advice from a professional aspect would be to not do so because, should the area become infected and problems arise, it would propbably open a can of (legal) worms.
No I dont agree this is correct, but it is (sadly) a reflection on the nature of the profession in these times.
Just because it's Friday I go to my work first aider with a splinter that is sticking out of the surface of my skin. They refuse to remove it. I finish my shift. It gets infected (It is after all a breach in my skin and an easy way in for the infection) I assume I can sue anyway??? The world has gone mad... My (old) first book says - remove using plastic tweezers if visible...
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Question..... Is it a wood or metal splinter?
Believe me it makes a massive difference!
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Leave it in, it will do some good!
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Still got a sliver of glass from a milk bottle in my finger from 25 years ago.
It has not harmed me yyyyyyyyyyyyeeeeeeeeeeettttttttttttt!!!!!!!!!!
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As a First Aider - no we are not allowed to remove splinters from any one. The person who has the splinter can remove it them selves, or it is to seek medical assistance.
I normally sugguest soaking it for about 20mins in a warm bath, and then see if you can remove the splinter. If finger begins to swell or pus starts coming out, then straight to see a nurse.
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Sorry to go off at a slight tangent but it is Friday - a chap I worked with a couple of years ago was gardening and he got a wood splinter in his palm on the weekend. He said he pulled out a splinter piece about 3/4" but complained to me on the Monday that he still had a blister type wound where it had been.
As I squinted at it from about 6" from his palm he squeezed it and another splinter popped out which must have been at least 3/4" of an inch long - worst thing I have seen!
Chuck some bacon fat on it and let nature take its course!!! Disclaimer - or seek Medical advice.
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http://www.firstaidcafe..../62/g/posts/t/4687/.aspxJust as agreeable as us :) The debate goes on... I don't have an up-to date first aid at work manual to hand - but as above my old edition says to use tweezers... I always look upon this as the bible of first aid. Someone with the latest edition... what does it say? has anyone ever been sued for this? I still say - if I don't remove it and it gets infected the likelihood of claim is higher - also 90% of the time they will be able to remove it themselves and so no issue. As for those of you who are saying we were taught not to: as an instructor this is still one of those areas you can debate for hours and so... To add some clarity - My wife who is nurse just read this and thinks we are all insane :)
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teh_boy wrote:
To add some clarity - My wife who is nurse just read this and thinks we are all insane :)
Your good lady is not alone Ian
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There have been worse discussions on this forum.
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Perhaps that explains my feeling of déjà vu
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No doubt Mrs teh_boy feels the same
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It's a cracker...remember it's theoretical question.
Not wishing to hijack this thread, but earlier this week it was suggested that an injured person who refuses medical treatment at a hospital could be disciplined. My thoughts are not printable.
Have a good weekend and don't have nightmares.
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I feel this post is getting out of hand.
You should call an ambulance and then a no win no fee solicitor.
!!
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RayRapp wrote:It's a cracker...remember it's theoretical question.
Not wishing to hijack this thread, but earlier this week it was suggested that an injured person who refuses medical treatment at a hospital could be disciplined. My thoughts are not printable.
Have a good weekend and don't have nightmares. Is this available on the NHS or just for those enjoying the benefit of private healthcare :-o We digress. I am aware that some, maybe all fIrst aid training is teaching that the removal of a splinter is an invasive procedure. Personally I despair at this position. I've had countless splinters over the years, mainly wood but also metal, and I would guess a bit of all sorts over the last 50 years. I've had a couple of absolute corkers as well. I've had some taken out by first aiders but mostly by me, usually with a clean, but not sterile scalpel blade, but occasionally a nice sharp chisel has done the trick. I don't know if I have been especially lucky but to my recollection, I have not had any raging infection that required any further medical intervention. I don't know how I've survived to date! For anyone following the ambulance watch/A&E debate in Norfolk, I'm pretty sure that for most splinters, shivers etc either 'first aid' or self help is generally the answer.
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canopener wrote:
.....first aid training is teaching that the removal of a splinter is an invasive procedure.
Err, isn't it the splinter that is doing the invading here? It's removal is perhaps quite the opposite
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Err, isn't it the splinter that is doing the invading here? It's removal is perhaps quite the opposite
Ian, I couldn't agree more. I am merely quoting the approach that first aid trainers appear to be adopting, and as observed at #1 of this thread.
If it helps, I personally wouldn't have much concern about removing the majority of splinters/shivers as a first aid procedure (do I hear gasps of shock/horror?). Lets face it most of us pull them out with our teeth as soon a I happens; and I would guess most of us have also managed to avoid necrotising fasciitis as a result!
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On my last first aid at work refresher I was instructed in how to remove splinters.
This part of the syllabus took about 30 seconds to cover.
I don't see the problem.
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Removing it themselves isn't always possible as it may be in an awkward position for them that another person is able to reach quite easily.
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Personally speaking I would be too embarrassed to seek first aid help to remove a splinter. if I couldn't remove it myself I'd just leave it in and get on with my life - it will come out eventually.
I usually suck and use a pin then maybe my teeth until it comes out ha ha !
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ian.blenkharn wrote:No doubt Mrs teh_boy feels the same :) but it's Monday now, time for some real work...
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teh_boy wrote:http://www.firstaidcafe.co.uk/tabid/62/g/posts/t/4687/.aspx
I don't have an up-to date first aid at work manual to hand - but as above my old edition says to use tweezers... I always look upon this as the bible of first aid. Someone with the latest edition... what does it say?
The latest version still includes removal of the splinter stating "often a splinter can be successfully withdrawn from the skin using tweezers....if it is deeply embedded, lies over a joint, or is difficult to remove, you should leave it in place and advise the casualty to seek medical help"
Also notes of caution about tetanus and immunisation and seeking advice for a dirty wound - includes step-by-step pictures too for the novice splinter remover....on a side note the next section covers embedded fish hooks!
B
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I'm not a first aider, but I'd tend to agree with #5 but it's got to be down to a sensible judgement of each case. I'd like to think that a small timber splinter which could be taken out with tweezers would be okay, glass or otherwise might be different, but I recall managing a wood machinist some years ago who came to me asking if I'd pull a splinter out of his hand which I can only describe as a tent peg - obviously that chap went straight to A&E.
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Last week my wife had a gardening accident, and managed to embed some splinters of bamboo about 15mm long, just under the skin of her palm. Her hand was bleeding profusely so I took her to A & E. After some digging around with the sharp end of a hypodermic needle the A & E sister and an ambulance technician (there on training) exposed the end of one of the splinters, but couldn't grip it properly with the plastic tweezers in their "foreign body extraction" kit due to the rounded ends. I suggested they used steel tweezers, but they told me they'd have to call a surgeon to use metal tweezers, because they were's allowed to use them... because of... can you guess what's coming yet... Elf 'n Safety!
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The thread that will not die.
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I'm old enough to have had first aid training where we were taught to remove splinters embedded in the eyeball!
I remember ( some 45 years later) we were solemnly told we had to send them to hospital if it was not in the white of the eye ( ie in the iris or pupil) and not tackle it ourselves.
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Radio 2 Breakfast show this morning spoke of spreading a plaster with honey and cover splinter and wound with it. Supposed to aid the splinter's ejection.
Waiting for the first splinter to check out!
Things don't become wives tales for nothing.
After working in catering in a previous life the head chef always used ground pepper on sprinkled on minor cuts until a plaster could be sourced - which always worked, another one I picked up is to wrap a cut in a cobweb.
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tigers wrote:Radio 2 Breakfast show this morning spoke of spreading a plaster with honey and cover splinter and wound with it. Supposed to aid the splinter's ejection.
Waiting for the first splinter to check out!
Things don't become wives tales for nothing.
After working in catering in a previous life the head chef always used ground pepper on sprinkled on minor cuts until a plaster could be sourced - which always worked, another one I picked up is to wrap a cut in a cobweb. But surely if a 1st aider were to that it would be classed as perscribing? ;-)
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May be described as prescribing (prescribed drugs - Web definitions - are those drugs obtained on a prescription). Not been to the Docs for honey lately so not too sure. But I'm assured honey is not invasive either #1
Anther anecdote about prescriptions, my father had a rash on his wrist once and went to see a Doctor (family friend) who prescribed a gold watch. He was unable ot cash it in as was not on the pharmacy's drug/equipment list.
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