Hi all

We have someone in house trained and qualified to PAT test single phase plugged equipment. We have been advised to start testing our other fixed equipment too. I'm looking at training for suitable staff and was wondering if anyone has experience with City & Guilds 2377. Anyone know if this will cover testing fixed equipment or 3 phase? There seem to be lots of adapters for connecting 3 phase to a PAT tester but I feel the staff would need training on how to interpret the results. Can anyone recommend other training routes?

P.A.T. = Portable appliance testing. There is a clue somewhere in the wording.

You'll need a Risk Assessment first by someone competent (by this I mean someone who is electrically qualified and with H&S training pref a Tech IOSH Perhaps an engineer like Paul Skyrme?)

Please don't take any notice of anyone else on this.

If temped to ask your 2377 chap to test the fixed wiring DON'T

Hi and thanks for the replies guys.

It was my understanding PAT testing was intended for movable or portable electrical equipment as the nature of it being moved around gave rise to conditions which may cause deterioration of the cables, plugs and insulation.

I have, however, been advised by THSP (our consultants) to start electrical testing on fixed equipment. The majority of which is 3 phase. The guy in question isn't as knowledgeable as he'd like to think; I spent hours arguing with him because we have a WSE for the LOLER TE's on our cranes and he wouldn't accept timescales different to the statutes (although perfectly legal).

As for the risks; I think he is trying to reduce the risk of us not needing them any more and finding things to keep us busy with! I personally see no significant risk from electrical safety of our fixed kit. We had the install tested by competent electricians when we moved into the premises 3 years ago (I believe we should have this done every 5 years), I see no real risk here anyways.

I have seen a lot of companies sell 3 phase adapters for PAT kits; is this essentially a false economy? My electrical knowledge isn't too great and I can find little in PUWER or EAW to justify such testing. Nor do I really understand the differences between single and 3 phase so go easy please.

I understand your point about the risk being ours. As far as I'm aware they have no benefit from advising us to test all electrical equipment other than if they were to say "your doing good without us"; they'd lose a customer.

Our equipment mainly consists of welding kit (subject to user inspections daily) and fixed machinery such as a guillotine and press brakes. All of which we have suitable inspections carried out under PUWER including checking the cables for damage prior to use. These are operated in sheet metal fabrication workshop. Our building is in good condition and there is no damp, extreme temperature conditions or explosive atmospheres.

Personally; I don't see how this exercise would reduce risk.

We have a very well ventilated work space with LEV at point of source for fume extraction. Welding different materials produces different fumes but they do generally contain conductive particles. All our kit has been purchased new within the last 7 years and is suitably inspected under PUWER regularly.

PAT is not concerned with internal contamination. Your inspection should check the plug, fuse, cable grips,cables and casing of the device for contamination. Recently a grinder shorted 2 weeks after passing an inspection, insulation test and leakage test (class 2 device) due to internal contamination from dust. Which really leads me in a full circle; how valid is PAT on 3 phase? It lacks a certain validity on portable tools and I still fail to see how being advised to carry out this process on a 3 meter wide press brake will lower the electrical risks. The real risks from a machine like this come from the safety features failing, all of which are inspected weekly. The cables don't move and are inspected weekly, this should allow us to detect if they are over heating.

If the risk is internal contamination from conductive particles; a cleaning and maintenance program would be a better way to tackle the risk (which we do). I'm still no clearer on how valid this process is (PAT on 3 phase) or if these 3 phase adapters (for PAT kits) on sale are a false economy. Not trying to argue; just find answers my questions...