Rank: Forum user
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Hi All
I would appreciate some advice on control measures for the following.
I am due to visit a school which has an outdoor swimming pool in their school grounds.
It is easily accessible to pupils (from age 9 - 18 yrs) and trespassers would only need to climb over the school gates to gain access into the grounds.
The swimming pool has not been in use for many years and has not been maintained, and showing signs of wear and tear (though structurally fine) the pool is full of rain water and more likely pond life!
The control measures in place at present are:
The students have been informed not to use or attempt to gain access into the area.
A 3ft fence has been erected all the way round the area (access via a gate)
I would advise they need to erect suitable and sufficient boundary fencing at a height which is not easily accessible.
I would also continue to monitor the area on a regular basis (this is done at present and they have an excellent monitoring regime in place)
My main question would be: Should they drain the pool or leave it in it's current state whilst they await planning permission etc to replace the pool with a building structure of some kind. (They are not keeping the pool)
I can see reasons on both sides to empty or not to empty?
What are your thoughts on this please.....
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Rank: Super forum user
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Is it possible to drain and fit some form of temporary but rigid cover in place until PP is through for the new structure? Thinking on the hoof - some form of scaffolding with boards fitted to stop them moving?
I would be looking to eliminate the risk in the first instance; especially as it is outdoors and does not appear from your description to be too difficult to gain access.
I guess that it largely deep ends (sorry!) on the size of the pool?
HTH
Stu
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Rank: Forum user
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I agree maybe a fixed cover would be best, but again this may take some time to organise so in the first instance do we go with the barriers to stop access into the area.
Do we drain the pool in the chance some-one gets over the barrier and decides to take a swim!! but ends up falling into a dry pool with serious injury.
Or keep the pool full and if someone fell in they may swim or drown!!
Which is the best option.
I will suggest the rigid cover.
To drain or not to drain that is the question (quoted by Hamlet!!)
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Rank: Super forum user
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Just a few thoughts:
How long was the pool in regular use?
How long has it been abandoned?
Have there been any instacnes of misue by pupils?
Is there any evidence or recorded instances of trepassers gaining access?
So the pool is going to be removed. What is the increase in possible liability over the period that it will take to gain Planning Permission? If the school hasn't seen fit to take action in the past (admittedly perhaps due to ignorance of potential liability!) what would justify spending money on something like (an expensive?) fixed cover for what might be a period of months/year or two at most?
Whilst there is a duty to trespassrs it isn't an absolute duty to guard them from every conceivable risk.
Phil
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Rank: Super forum user
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I personally think draining the pool is the least of your problems. I fail to see how it will take time to instruct a scaffold crew to put in a structure capable of stopping trespassers falling in? This would take maximum 2 days.
At present you have already omitted that it is foreseeable with the current control measures that trespassers and more importantly children can still gain access, which tells me the current control measures are inadequate. Whether they hurt themselves from falling or drowning is here nor there. Although I doubt you could argue that you left water in the swimming pool to minimize consequences :-)
My advice: Risk assess and implement ASAP
Good luck!
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Rank: Super forum user
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Just be aware if you drain the pool and leave it empty there is a chance the sides may fall in. The water within the pool is an important part of the construction. A solid top may stop people falling in but you might need to consider back filling to protect the structural integrity.
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Rank: Forum user
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What you are describing exists all over the country as natural and not so natural bodies of water.
Ensure that the pool is full of water so that anyone who happens to get in can get out and display a couple of deep water signs.
The site is already fenced off to prevent inadvertent access I believe so a few signs and the jobs a good one IMHO.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Dazzling Puddock wrote:What you are describing exists all over the country as natural and not so natural bodies of water.
Ensure that the pool is full of water so that anyone who happens to get in can get out and display a couple of deep water signs.
The site is already fenced off to prevent inadvertent access I believe so a few signs and the jobs a good one IMHO.
I think this was already referred to in the original question "It is easily accessible to pupils (from age 9 - 18 yrs) and trespassers would only need to climb over the school gates to gain access into the grounds." There was a recent request that I cant specifically make reference to (I have run a search but cannot locate at the moment) but the local authority was prosecuted because they was aware that the area was easily accessible.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Some Heras fencing would seem a reasonable, quick, proportionate and cost effective solution to me!
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Rank: Super forum user
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Essex CC was recently proseucted - but that was an accident during normal pool use.
Not sure that this is a situation akin to Tomlinson (drowning in inland open water) - which was decided in favour of Congleton LA, claimant failed. I'm sure there has been a case of tresppasers drowning... I'm back to the web!
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Rank: Super forum user
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There have been several other claims agisnt LA - but all from accidents during "use".
We should look at the view of the courts and take a sound risk based approach... consider the following cases where claims failed:
Keown vs Coventry Healthcare (2006): 11 year old - Fall when climbing up an external fire escape
Marsden vs Bourne Leisure (2009): Young child aged 2 wandered away from parents, "overcame" a low fence/barrier and drowned in a lake on a caravan site. NB this case went to Court of Appeal
Phil
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Rank: Forum user
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Thank you all for your replies and advice.
I have been to look at the pool again today (this is a private school) and I along with senior management have decided to go with the following control measures.
They are going to put a rigid structure over the pool to prevent illegal access (they experienced trespassers last summer who manage to get in across the fields adjoining the school!!)
The structure will be concrete sheets (will be extremely difficult to lift manually)
The school is also a boarding school with limited staff on duty at certain times (not all the children board)
The pool will be kept full of water as emptying the water will cause issues with the structure of the pool, until planning permission has been sought to change the area (listed building)
The fencing height has been increased and a sign will be erected warning of danger keep out.
Thank you again for the advice received.
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