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mssy  
#1 Posted : 06 September 2013 19:15:25(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
mssy

How do you get people to use the nearest fire exit?

I look after a tall building with 12 staircases, and during successive fire drills some staircases a bursting to the point of people queuing to enter and descend the staircase, whilst others are barely used.

There is not a capacity issue here if only staff spread out and used their nearest exit!

We have tried everything from additional signage, posters, dropping hundreds of pens & notepads (with a message printed on them) on hundreds of desks overnight! – plus huge changes to staff training and even a changed voice message on the alarm system

But no, everyone wants to use the staircases they enter the building by!

I am thinking of setting up machine guns near the most popular escape routes in order to deter staff, but thought I would ask here for alternative suggestions first. So have any of you experienced this imbalanced use of staircases problems, and if so, how have you resolved the problem?
johnmc  
#2 Posted : 06 September 2013 19:40:29(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
johnmc

Hi mssy,

I am unsure if this will be possible but when faced with a similar problem I delivered a fire training session which featured a video and information from the "station night club" in Rhode Island in which 100 people died many of whom got trapped trying to leave the way they came in. It is a very powerful video which will help open people's eyes to the risks of being caught unaware or unfamiliar with your surroundings. It has got me to always check fire exits/routes when in new places. All the information is available online. I know this may not be a workable solution due to numbers etc, but if even just the fire marshals and managers/supervisors receive a briefing on the above I am sure it will help. If I can help please pm me.
Good luck, John
garyc  
#3 Posted : 06 September 2013 21:11:37(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
garyc

Hi, my take is that most will exit the way they enter on a daily basis as a natural instinct.
More of a walk through talk through and several practices along with the use of increased Fire Marshals has worked for me.
pete48  
#4 Posted : 07 September 2013 11:34:33(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
pete48

Have you tried blocking egress towards the 'normal route' and/or access to some staircases during drills? Scenario is that the incident is in that area or on their route to 'normal' exit.
It does help people to think outside their normal response to leaving the building as well as highlighting optional routes to them. I have had some good success with this approach albeit that in a real emergency I expect many would still go unthinking towards their normal way out.

p48
Safety Smurf  
#5 Posted : 08 September 2013 12:18:12(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Safety Smurf

Hi Mssy,

The short answer is you can't. As others have already mentioned its normal human behaviour (actually its animal instinct).

Blocking particular routes during drills is probably the only way to get the other routes used but as Pete mentioned people will always go to the familiar in times of danger. Hopefully if there was a real fire on that route then that's when the training on the alternatives would kick in.

I've seen people sat next to a fire exit during a drill travel the entire length of building to leave by the door they came in through!
stuie  
#6 Posted : 08 September 2013 12:40:19(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
stuie

I'm with pete48 on this one - block their normal exit route with a board or such like with a picture of a fire on it - either that or stand there and tell them they are all dead now from smoke inhalation :-)
mssy  
#7 Posted : 08 September 2013 18:33:24(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
mssy

Thanks for your replies so far.

The issue is a bit more complicated than shutting off 'their usual route'. This building has more than 5000 people inside and has 12 staircases. Staff tend to use the 5 main staircases rather than all 12 (ie their nearest)

So if I was to close the usual exit routes, it would mean closing 5 staircases, which would then serious overcrowd the remaining 7 making the whole exercise pointless. Plus with 12 floors, closing 5 staircases would require blocking 60+ access points

Of course, a staircase could be closed at each successive fire drill, but this would take five years to get the message across!!! Additional fire drills are not an option.

I am thinking of reviewing signage to show the point where the direction of the nearest exit route changes ( such as <- nearest fire exit -> ), plus additional signage to the rarely used stairs, and changing the role of fire wardens to visual show staff the correct route with arm movements (like air crew on a plane) when an evacuation is in progress.

I still dont think it's enough so would appreciate any more advice or experiences
firesafety101  
#8 Posted : 08 September 2013 21:43:52(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

messy some of the problems associated with fire exits are because staff are told they are fire exits and not a general staircase for normal use.

Some fire exits look like a door in a wall whereas the accommodation stairs are much prettier and "want" to be used.

Staff do not normally use the fire exits when entering the premises and going to their workplace.

There may be more but I'm sure you will agree.

It is human nature to do the things we feel comfortable with and no matter how hard you try there will always be people wanting to use their favourite staircase.

Just make sure if you have Fire Marshals that they are well up to dealing with people during a real fire/evacuation and can direct everyone away from the danger of a staircase on fire. You could concentrate their fire training to ensure this happens.

This shouldn't happen by the way, why do we think the fire will involve a staircase when it should always be clear of combustibles and the doors should be self closing?

An evacuation may not be because of a fire, think bomb alert, and then all staircase need to be used, as long as the threat is not to a staircase of course.

saferay  
#9 Posted : 09 September 2013 15:51:19(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
saferay

mssy

You don't have to block all five exits on all floors. Just pick a couple of exits on different floors for each drill. This will spread the message gradually rather than creating a problem in a single event.

Safe_ray
Steve e ashton  
#10 Posted : 10 September 2013 21:21:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Steve e ashton

DOUGHNUTS!!!

Stand at the bottom of one of the unused stairwells with a tray of doughnuts to reward those who exhibit the behaviour you want to reinforce...

Word will spread quickly enough (but you'll need to do a different stairwell each drill so people don't all rush for the one stair where they know there were doughnuts last time!)

Steve
grumpyB  
#11 Posted : 11 September 2013 11:07:31(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
grumpyB

I am very surprised that anyone would advocate blocking a fire exit even though the alarm is for a drill? I would assume that the exercise is not announced as a drill? If you have that volume of people heading for what is a choked exit anyway I find the possible catastrophic nature of what could happen next quite disturbing. Whilst useful on paper to re-educate people, the thought of people being crushed against a blocked fire exit and then the ensuing panic as they try to find an alternative exit quite frightening. Isn't this why we go around in our day to day roles to ensure they are not obstructed? I think several slow time evacuations with fire marshals providing redirection where necessary may be a better solution.
Just my opinion.
Good luck
Barry
achrn  
#12 Posted : 11 September 2013 11:24:46(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
achrn

grumpyb wrote:
I am very surprised that anyone would advocate blocking a fire exit even though the alarm is for a drill? I would assume that the exercise is not announced as a drill?


I think blocking a route is a good approach.

At my primary school every fire drill featured a simulated fire at some location (it was actually a devilish papier-mache guy / dummy with horns on his head, wearing an academic gown, clutching a pitchfork and sitting on a chair decorated with crepe-paper flames). The dummy was where the fire was, you weren't allowed to pass the dummy, so if you came across the dummy you had to find another route.

I've always thought this a much more effective approach to a fire-drill than any at any other place I've been in the 40 years since.

kevkel  
#13 Posted : 11 September 2013 15:55:37(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
kevkel

steve e ashton wrote:
DOUGHNUTS!!!

Stand at the bottom of one of the unused stairwells with a tray of doughnuts to reward those who exhibit the behaviour you want to reinforce...

Word will spread quickly enough (but you'll need to do a different stairwell each drill so people don't all rush for the one stair where they know there were doughnuts last time!)

Steve



Reminds me of family guy! "oh a piece of candy", "oh a piece of candy"
martin1  
#14 Posted : 11 September 2013 16:29:06(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
martin1

grumpyb

Block may be the wrong word.

The exit should never be "blocked" with anything that can't be easily removed.

A Fire Warden or similar soul could stand at the exit and "block" it. People will immediatly see it is a drill and there will be no panic.

The cardboard with a picture of the fire is good idea providing it does not really block the exit and people are informaed to expect such hi-jinks during drills.
firesafety101  
#15 Posted : 11 September 2013 16:54:36(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

Make sure the cardboard cut out does not present a fire hazard in itself, it will be on the route to a fire exit.
achrn  
#16 Posted : 12 September 2013 08:35:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
achrn

Firesafety101 wrote:
Make sure the cardboard cut out does not present a fire hazard in itself, it will be on the route to a fire exit.


Pretty much every place in any building is on the route to a fire exit. In my building we allow combustible items between a person and their nearest fire exit. It's hard to imagine anywhere prohibits it.
KieranD  
#17 Posted : 12 September 2013 09:52:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
KieranD

Mssy

You wrote: How do you get people to use the nearest fire exit?

I look after a tall building with 12 staircases, and during successive fire drills some staircases a bursting to the point of people queuing to enter and descend the staircase, whilst others are barely used.

There is not a capacity issue here if only staff spread out and used their nearest exit!

We have tried everything

Actually, you have NOT tried 'everything'; on the basis of what you have written, you have actually limited your range of choices to fairly self-evident technical solutions.

There are two straightforward sets of options which you don't even mention. One is 'behavioural safety', which you can read about in several well-written guides, in particular the one by Dominic Cooper and available to buy on his website. The other is 'Positive Safety', about which I'll let you have a simple 1-page summary if you pm me.

While they may require more work on your part than machine guns, they're a lot less expensive and the consequences are normally a lot less bothersome for all concerned.
chris42  
#18 Posted : 12 September 2013 10:56:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

When you asked the people who obviously didn't use the nearest exit route, what did they give as a reason ?

I only ask because we ( on a much smaller scale) had the same issue. It turned out that they knew it was a drill and didn't want to break the glass on the break glass door lock !!. So we took them to the door and smashed one for the hell of it, and show there was no problem.

Curious to what your people gave as a reason.
Blue  
#19 Posted : 12 September 2013 13:56:24(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Blue

Messy

It could be a useful exercise to take people down the 'unused' staircases to familiarise them with where they go to. It is possible they won't use them out of fear of the unknown.

You could also video both exit routes during an evacuation and then show this back to them explaining what the dangers are and how they could speed up evacuation by being more evenly spread. Just an idea worth trying.

Good luck
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