An exercise I once did with a Board was to split them into 2 teams - prosecution and defence and then give them an accident (similar to the things happening in the company), pretend the IP was seriously hurt, HSE investigated and we were in court. By getting them to think through how they were going to defend the case and how they could pick holes it certainly raised their awareness. Also you are not talking to them - but helping them to figure it out for themselves. The challenge you will have is getting them to let you run the exercise - suggest it is part of their development as Board responsible members!

I was once in this position myself back in early to mid 2008.
I had joined a "family ran" company as Health & Safety Manager and came across pretty much a similar situation that you now appear to be in.
After 7 months of trying to steer them in the right direction i got sick of banging my head against the wall, getting stressed by the situation and handed my notice in.
Much to my surprise when i submitted my notice they begged me to stay! even promising to listen and act upon my advice from then on! - but i had secured employment elsewhere and was in no way going to stay.

The only good thing to come out of it was it was a steep learning curve in how to manage/deal with difficult if not some impossible people.

Keep all your documentation / emails / notes etc. up to date is all I can say. What would happen if an inspector were to call?

No real biggies recently to draw upon; in the past they've just thrown money at the problem to go away.

Pulling out some relevant case law examples and the resulting fines produced laughter and comments along the lines of "I spent more on my holiday last year".

The HSE is toothless; and as mentioned above almost totally invisible on most company radars as long as they operate.

How about sumpleting a safety culture survey of your company?
You could group the data by managers, staff, etc and the resultant radar plot is helpful. If you complete the analysis for each group seperately, eg senior managers, managers and staff, you could overlay them and show the differences / acreas of concern. It does depend on the size of the organisation.

As defeatist as this sounds it may in fact be the only realistic answer if they are as bad as you say.

However, I would say that the approach you adopt can make a huge difference. IMO too many practitioners adopt a heavy handed and gold standard approach when they would be better off going at it softly softly, one step at a time.

If they are HSE enforced then you could lay out the potential uninsurable costs of the HSE's charging regime.

Nimble, difficult one. In addition to the good advice above, it sounds as they they are lacking in knowledge. Family firms are hard to deal with as there is no shareholder, the board are the extended family and they see it of minimal consequence.

Its almost back to square one I suspect, trawl the safety mags, websites and the HSE website for cases similar to your industry where there are fines, look for where directors of family firms have been jailed/fined, compile these into a useful 'industry safety update'..??

Add up the costs of all the clims and accidents and the financial effects, using hard figures in a 'safety costs' report', of money wasted might just make them sit up an listen.

Do you have any main competitors that do safety better than your company, take time to do 'competitor analysis' to point out how firm X has 18001, how firm Y has won some awards, how firm Z is working with its main client on class leading initiatives etc, with the subtle message that they are better than your company?

Is any department making headway in dragging the leadership of the firm into the 21st century? If so team up with them and the consultants they might use to start possibly selling a well-crafted safety message about the benefits of good safety.

Send the board and other directors the IoD guidance...?

And all of this, it might not work, in which case find another job and call the HSE as you leave....

“You can't always get what you want, But if you try sometimes, well you might find, you get what you need.” (Rolling Stones)
Welcome to the real world. I suggest that what you describe exists in many a company. You have landed with a group of successful risk takers! They have been well rewarded, both in financial terms and self esteem, for their risk taking. And why not? Despite what the training and documentation says it is not essential to have the hearts and minds of the boss group before anything changes.
We cannot know the exact circumstances of course but if I may quote you on one point and explore that. “No real biggies recently to draw upon; in the past they've just thrown money at the problem to go away.”
So it has worked for them until now? Maybe not a perfect world or even a morally supportable position but nonetheless effective for them. As to whether they are deluded I am not so sure. They are doing what their experience tells them is effective.
You are the new kid on the block so you still have time to identify a strategy to achieve what they want and what you recommend is needed. So I wouldn’t go rushing away from an opportunity like this too soon. It is important however to get that strategy sorted with your line boss (i.e. one individual) as soon as possible now that you have a sense of the state of OSH. What do they actually want from you and what do you want from them. If that comes together in a form that you can accept then stay and get on with it. If it doesn’t then book you ticket!

What do you need at this stage? Hearts and minds of the bosses as a team or the heart and mind of one of those ‘individuals’ you have identified. You have to start somewhere and the toenails are one way for a mouse to start eating an elephant. There may be many things you can try that focus on one area or one manager. Get it done where you can. For example, is informality necessarily a bad thing at this stage?

How big is the problem? I once made assessments as if I were an Inspector and looked for activity or kit about which I might be minded to issue improvement or prohibition notices. This gave me a good feel for the loss potential irrespective of whether an accident ever happened or not. It helped others to see the matter as a loss control matter rather than OSH. It also helped me to get a better grasp of the ‘biggies’ and ‘importants’ from a different perspective.

What timescale is reasonable? It is important in my view that you have a timescale in your plan that will not only allow reviewing effectively but also gives you a bottom line as to when you do pack your bag and move on. My advice would be that should be when you have decided that you will not be able to gain any further improvement rather than the fact that there may be some ‘dire’ conditions and attitudes about.

p48

Great topic and thanks for posting. If you leave, some other poor soul may have to take on the challenge whether as full time employee or consultant, and that is what it is and what you are being compensated for in the employer's eyes. In your eyes it might be insurmountable, but there are others who may relish the challenge that this opportunity poses. However, if it is causing you stress that you cannot deal with, and your employer is not willing to help you resolve this, then moving onto another challenge is perhaps what you should do.

I am with David B. Good advice.

Working in such an environment with scant regard to safety is not easy. Many of us have been there. If you are not on the ball you can become a part of their culture and could end up endorsing their approach because of being in a no win situation. However, what if it all hits the fan? From what you describe IMO it's a case of do I stay or do I go? Only you can make that decision. I wish you good luck.

69 for sure, 13 watched it on the telly. Followed them before they were famous,

......back to the original post.

In such circumstances Nimble057, it is sometimes worth utilising an external source / consultant / business who has no axe to grind, has experience of what doing nothing can result in, the 'pain' & the 'costs' blah, blah, blah.

I remember being called by such some years ago - H&S Man struggling. I did an audit & then a presentation with the aim to 'fasten electrodes'. Only five minutes into my presentationan & the CEO swivelled sideways to look away & said "I think I've heard enough". "ok" I replied & started to pack up. All hell broke loose before I was asked to continue. At the end I left, not sure whether my message got through but some improvements were under way, Action Plan etc but at a slow pace..... yes you guessed if, three months later I was called..... major accident. Hhhmmmm, welll don't say I didn't tell you. Result CEO removed by the rest of the Board, HSE Prosecution etc etc...... business now in a good place in terms of H&S.

Now if you can get someone / business or whatever in to do similar, BEFORE the thing hits the fan, well it may help. Try your local Rotary Club, you may find someone there who has had problems. Worth a try I reckon.