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sdeans  
#1 Posted : 14 February 2014 15:09:38(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
sdeans

Hi folks,

A quick question on the above. Does the training need to be carried out by a training provider accredited with a body such as UKATA? I ask in the hope that we can run the course in house to save on costs. We have a considerable number of guys who need put through the training and I was hoping to do this myself.

Reading through the Control of Asbestos Regs they seem to state that if you are competent and follow the basic criteria laid down in the Regs you can do it yourself. I am a Chartered Member with over 16 years working in H&S, 12 of these involved in construction with a lot of asbestos work.

Any thoughts from the forum are welcome.
Cerith  
#2 Posted : 14 February 2014 15:17:55(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Cerith

Looked at this a few weeks ago.
Does not have to be accredited, as long as you can prove competence etc.
However, a lot of our work is for a water board, who insisted on it being UKATA accredited!
sdeans  
#3 Posted : 14 February 2014 15:21:55(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
sdeans

Thanks for the quick response! This is just for in house guys and I feel confident enough and sufficiently knowledgeable to deliver this to a decent standard.
rodgerker  
#4 Posted : 14 February 2014 15:37:02(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
rodgerker

Before considering carrying out this training in house I would suggest you think long and hard.

If you provide the training and its your name on the certificate, it will be your responsibility if it goes wrong.

I am always wary when people use the phrase "-- in house to save costs".

Please don't take this personally, but any idiot can save costs and money, it takes a lot of management skills to produce something that is "cost effective" or "cost beneficial". Both are far more important than "saving costs".

By all means undertake it in house if you feel you are competent, but remember if it does go wrong at some time in the future, the people for whom you saved the money will be unlikely to come running to your defence.

While UKATA or others are not the be-all and end-all of asbestos training, they do at least come with a "Logo" that people recognise.

Rodger Ker
frankc  
#5 Posted : 14 February 2014 21:48:01(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
frankc

sdeans wrote:
Hi folks,

A quick question on the above. Does the training need to be carried out by a training provider accredited with a body such as UKATA?

Any thoughts from the forum are welcome.


Quick answer. No. 'Suitable and sufficient training' are the requirements.
Not UKATA, unless specifically asked for.
As for your competence to deliver the training yourself, with your 16 years experience in H&S and '12 years in construction with a lot of Asbestos work', that should be sufficient to tell them where they could potentially come into contact with Asbestos and what procedures to take should they do so or believe they have.
Frank Hallett  
#6 Posted : 15 February 2014 10:04:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Frank Hallett

It depends on the type of training that you're referring to here.

Is it "awareness" level training as required for ALL employees who may have a need to recognise asbestos containing materials and/or undertake non-licensed and non-notifiable work? If so, as long as you are sufficiently competent [you decide], there is no bar to you providing.

However, to provide the necessary full training even at this level requires considerably more than simple knowledge of the A@W Regs. You will need a good understanding of the types and use of essential PPE and also ancillary skills.

This is still no bar to doing this in-house.

For Non-licensed but Notifiable, you could still probably achieve this in-house.

For Licensed work - I would say say not unless you are in an Asbestos Licensed business.

Frank Hallett
John M  
#7 Posted : 15 February 2014 12:14:12(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
John M

AA training has been a requirement long before the creation of UKATA. So the essential questions is -what did they do before UKATA spawned.?

If confident and you follow the requirements of the particular regulations (content) do it yourself.

Jon
sdeans  
#8 Posted : 16 February 2014 19:22:39(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
sdeans

Thanks for the responses from everyone.

This is awareness training for installers who may come into contact with it. It is not just about saving costs. However the cost of having approximately 500 individuals undertaking the training is vast when there is no need for us to spend this money. I have attended awareness training from UKATA providers in the past and there is no reason why I cannot deliver this. I have a lot of knowledge and experience in practical terms of delivering this.
Sutty31  
#9 Posted : 17 February 2014 06:52:29(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Sutty31

AA training does not have to be accredited / certificated... just ensure it complies fully with Reg 10 of CAR. However, as I have also experienced there are clients who insist on UKATA.... in the immortal words of Bruce Hornsby... " thats just the way it is"

Reg 10 :

You will need awareness training so you know how to avoid the risks and how to protect yourself. Asbestos awareness training should include the following topics:

The properties of asbestos and its effects on health, including the increased risk of developing lung cancer for asbestos workers who smoke
The types, uses and likely occurrence of asbestos and asbestos materials in buildings and plant
The general procedures to deal with an emergency, e.g. an uncontrolled release of asbestos dust into the workplace
How to avoid the risk of exposure to asbestos.
JohnW  
#10 Posted : 17 February 2014 12:19:27(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
JohnW

sdeans,

I prepared my own asbestos awareness training, based on requirements of Reg 10. This was for artwork installers who might come into contact with asbestos in walls.
I trained then 8 at a time with ppt, photos, samples. The final training was what to do if a) small amount suspect dust got onto clothing, shoes (wipe with wet cloth) b) significant amount suspect dust got onto clothing, shoes, hair, (needing shower). And all the necessary precautions, disposal etc
I produced an A4 Flowchart of what to do.
Also there was a 15 question test, multiple choice, this aims to show effectiveness of training. The training took 2 hours per session.
The training course was pre-approved by my customer's main client, a major pub owner in UK, who wanted text of their own policies included so I can't share the documents with you.
But hopefully you can approach this subject in a similar manner. Getting client's nod is useful.
John
sdeans  
#11 Posted : 17 February 2014 16:55:33(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
sdeans

John - Yes this is the approach I will be taking. Funnily enough, none of our clients have asked us for this (and they are all major worldwide clients)! This is something I feel the guys need to understand before they start drilling into walls without having some sort of awareness on the subject. Asbestos and lack of understand of it has been a bug bear of mine for some time. Considering the amount of lives lost each year and some pretty high profile campaigns over the years, the lack of awareness of the subject never fails to surprise me!!
alistair  
#12 Posted : 18 February 2014 09:26:42(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
alistair

Our approach =
For asbestos awareness training, in-house is fine and the HSE site has some excellent training tools. For non-licensed and notifiable non-licensed training we use UKATA providers. But also note that if UKATA do non-licensed or NNLW training they can combine awareness training and even face-fit testing for you.
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