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VLWood  
#1 Posted : 26 September 2014 10:27:35(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
VLWood

Hi, Ive been advised by a colleague that I should take out professional indemnity insurance but am not sure if I need it.
I am an employed HSE Manager. I do not provide consultancy or advisory services to anyone other than my direct employer.
The company already have directors insurance and both public and employers liability policies.
Do I personally need to take out professional indemnity? Any advice welcome.
Ian Bell  
#2 Posted : 26 September 2014 11:31:16(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ian Bell

No.

As an employee your company takes responsbility for your advice/work/actions.


See the priciples of vicarious liability.
westonphil  
#3 Posted : 26 September 2014 12:34:41(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
westonphil

As Ian says, no you do not.

Regards
KieranD  
#4 Posted : 30 September 2014 04:56:25(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
KieranD

VLWood

As an employed HSE Manager, you have responsibilities to comply with The Equality Act 2010, personally.

A leading barrister specialising in this area and a director of the Discrimination Law Association, Catherine Casserly, expressly warned a meeting of the IOSH London Met branch that her strategy is to issue proceedings against H & S professionals personally as well as their employers if she acted on a claim for unlawful discrimination.

Her words to the meeting were:
'If I were you, I'd look to your professional indemnity cover, personally!'.

Be warned - there is no limit to penalties under The Equality Act.
walker  
#5 Posted : 30 September 2014 08:28:36(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
walker

KieranD wrote:
VLWood

As an employed HSE Manager, you have responsibilities to comply with The Equality Act 2010, personally.

A leading barrister specialising in this area and a director of the Discrimination Law Association, Catherine Casserly, expressly warned a meeting of the IOSH London Met branch that her strategy is to issue proceedings against H & S professionals personally as well as their employers if she acted on a claim for unlawful discrimination.

Her words to the meeting were:
'If I were you, I'd look to your professional indemnity cover, personally!'.

Be warned - there is no limit to penalties under The Equality Act.


Sounds to me like an urban myth in the making
Can you cite instances where this has actually happened?
Ian Bell  
#6 Posted : 30 September 2014 09:01:21(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ian Bell

Sounds like another legal shark trying to fund her own lifestyle, inflicting misery on others because its all PC to do so.
Ian Bell  
#7 Posted : 30 September 2014 09:06:50(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ian Bell

Additionally, even as an employed h&s manager, you would make it quite clear to your employer your advice only realates to h&s matters as related to HASWA.

If there is an equality angle to an issue, a company should also seek advice from someone qualified to give advice as it related to the Equality Act.

More scaremongering from the pseudo-intellectual’s on this site.
toe  
#8 Posted : 01 October 2014 21:39:42(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
toe

I read with interest. Replies on this post are correct that it is up to your employer to have appropriate insurance for the nature of their work. However, it may be that your employer requires to have professional indemnity insurance to cover themselves for their employees giving out professional advice.

My employer recently had to include professional indemnity added to their insurance cover, the reason being I was carrying out FRA's on premises not owned by us and I was giving out fire safety advice, in which the landlord (duty holder - responsible person) required to take action based on my assessment.

BTW - I thought that H&S law trumps equality laws, bring it on Ms Casserly, my company is insured.
Ian Bell  
#9 Posted : 01 October 2014 22:47:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ian Bell

This is a slightly different scenario.

However it remains that the individual employee does not have to personally pay for/take out PI insurance.
bob youel  
#10 Posted : 23 October 2014 07:50:03(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

to put your mind at rest just confirm with your insurers that U are actually covered as people assume that they are covered but in many cases they are not as on many occasions cover only accounts for directors and the like and also confirm just what the company would do to protect U in case of a problem noting that a companies solicitors would protect those at the top first

Only recently a team of local authority EHO's I know of found out that they were not covered by their employers insurances yet they assumed for years that they had been covered
walker  
#11 Posted : 23 October 2014 10:14:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
walker

bob youel wrote:

Only recently a team of local authority EHO's I know of found out that they were not covered by their employers insurances yet they assumed for years that they had been covered


I have great difficulty in believing that.
It runs counter to everything I know about Safety & employment laws.
I will admit however I'm no expert on the subject.

Even if the LA has somehow not insured them, they (the employer) are still the ones entirely liable for any damages arising from their employee's activities.
pete48  
#12 Posted : 23 October 2014 10:33:12(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
pete48

I am with Bob on this one.

Whilst it is true that in most cases employees are covered by their employers PLI it is not universally so and even if it is/was in place then the protection might not extend or cover.

You don't have to have it, whether employed or not, but it might be prudent dependent on your personal circumstances as an employee. I would say OSH managers are one type of employee that should look very closely at their situation.

http://cic.org.uk/admin/...ability-of-employees.pdf

hth
p48
pl53  
#13 Posted : 23 October 2014 11:57:45(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
pl53

KieranD wrote:
VLWood

As an employed HSE Manager, you have responsibilities to comply with The Equality Act 2010, personally.

A leading barrister specialising in this area and a director of the Discrimination Law Association, Catherine Casserly, expressly warned a meeting of the IOSH London Met branch that her strategy is to issue proceedings against H & S professionals personally as well as their employers if she acted on a claim for unlawful discrimination.

Her words to the meeting were:
'If I were you, I'd look to your professional indemnity cover, personally!'.

Be warned - there is no limit to penalties under The Equality Act.



The Equality Act covers HR issues not health and safety issues. It is only relevant in as much as the company has a duty to make reasonable adjustments that may have a health and safety implication, but that is the limit of its applicability. This is a total red herring.The OP is an employee of a company and has no need for PII in any circumstance related to the work he does for his employer.

"If I were a leading barrister, I'd look to engaging the brain before putting the mouth into gear, personally"
bob youel  
#14 Posted : 18 November 2014 08:26:44(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

To have personal PII or not to have personal PII where U are an employee of a company is an interesting question and as yet, as far as I am aware, the area has not been tested in a court ---- I advise all to look at this area as an employee working on behalf of their employer as their employers insurances may not cover them under certain situations

And as for which is the best way to go - its all down to circumstances and a persons own situation noting that today agencies will not work with sole traders only with umbrellas and limited. I know that this is a cop-out with regards to the master servant relationship philosophy but there is not much U can do if U use agencies [who are very good on the whole and can save U £ with regards to marketing etc.] as the tax and social security people are very powerful and breath down the neck of agencies

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