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Hi all
I am looking to roll out the UKATA Asbestos awareness through elearning for a number of employees. However, does anyone think that it may be just as beneficial to hold an Asbestos Awarenss toolbox talk? Would this tick the box under the Control of Asbestos Regs as well as giving the info required? I know that the quoted reg (see below) lists a lot of things to be covered but by using this surely I could create a comprehensive talk that covers the points and would be more cost and time efficient?
Ref the below (Reg 10)
10. (1) Every employer must ensure that any employee employed by that employer is given adequate information, instruction and training where that employee—
(a)is or is liable to be exposed to asbestos, or if that employee supervises such employees etc etc
Thoughts?
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Rank: Super forum user
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I undertake the asbestos awareness training for our company in the form of a presentation however I do have a number of years experience in the field.
We used a professional organisation once and they didnt tell me anything I didnt already know so I just decided to put a presentation together and have delivered it ever since (modifying the relevant areas of the presentation when neccessary obviously).
Remember the training must be proportionate to the job role
Why not do the course yourself then if you feel comfortable delivering and feel you can answer any questions etc then go for it. If you feel your out of your depth you have lost nothing and you can then send them on the course.
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Paul
A great suggestion - and something I have already done!
As you found, they told me nothing I didn't know already. There was no lightbulb moment at all. Knowing that someone has already gone down the path that I am intending to take and has survived is reassuring...thanks!
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Rank: Super forum user
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ashley.willson wrote:Hi all
I am looking to roll out the UKATA Asbestos awareness through elearning for a number of employees. However, does anyone think that it may be just as beneficial to hold an Asbestos Awarenss toolbox talk? Would this tick the box under the Control of Asbestos Regs as well as giving the info required? I know that the quoted reg (see below) lists a lot of things to be covered but by using this surely I could create a comprehensive talk that covers the points and would be more cost and time efficient?
Ref the below (Reg 10)
10. (1) Every employer must ensure that any employee employed by that employer is given adequate information, instruction and training where that employee—
(a)is or is liable to be exposed to asbestos, or if that employee supervises such employees etc etc
Thoughts? My thoughts are you haven't said what kind of work the employees do so it's difficult to comment. I did notice you speak of a 'toolbox talk' whereas Paulw mentions a 'Presentation'. Surely one is longer and more in depth than the other? Also Paul mentions a valid point of fielding questions. Good luck with your choice.
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Rank: Forum user
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I currently deliver our asbestos awareness in house for site managers (construction) which last around 3 hours including a 15 minute video, plus there is multi choice question test at the end with a 85% requirement to pass. In addition to this they sit an online refresher each year and the full course at 5 year interval.
If you feel confident enough in your capabilities and have sufficient knowledge, then do your own. The HSE web site is excellent for pictures etc
Regards
PaulR
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Paul
Thanks for that input. It's useful to see how other people are considering time scales too. I tend to run a shorter course (lasting appx 45mins to 1 hour) every year at present which tends to take the form of a toolbox talk but I like the idea of doing a longer initial course and then shorter refreshers, redoing the course at 5 years so that may be borrowed!
Frank - I think in reality the difference between a toolbox talk and the presentation would really only be the venue. A toolbox talk can last any length of time really and with modern technology (I.e laptops!) we can deliver any presentation on any site in the world. I would argue that, really, they are one in the same.
Thanks!
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Rank: Super forum user
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I developed a training module on asbestos awareness for a client whose staff hang pictures and artwork in refurbished hotels and pubs etc, in premises that have had asbestos survey but there is just the chance that they might encounter something suspicious in walls of the buildings. The course was approved by one of their clients, a major UK pub chain.
The course includes legal explanations, photos and asbestos samples. There is some detail on the actions to be taken if a) small amount of suspect bust gets on shoes or sleeves of b) more suspect dust gets onto clothes or into hair. Attendees are given a flowchart for revision on what to do.
The course includes a 15 question test, if there's a group I allow them to confer to get 100% score :o)
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Rank: Super forum user
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ashley.willson wrote:
Frank - I think in reality the difference between a toolbox talk and the presentation would really only be the venue. A toolbox talk can last any length of time really and with modern technology (I.e laptops!) we can deliver any presentation on any site in the world. I would argue that, really, they are one in the same.
Thanks!
I wouldn't. You have already said your 'Toolbox Talk' is 45 minutes to one hour. Paul's course takes 3 hours. UKATA state Unit 'A' should take between 3 to 4 hours. Major difference imho.
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But, as I said, a toolbox talk can last any length of time (although we run a minimum of 30 mins as this makes it claimable through CITB!). The only reason for running mine at 45 mins to 1 hour (currently) is that I run it every year, where Pauls lasts for 5 years! Toolbox talk training is simply training that runs on site. The name comes from site workers sitting on their toolbox while the training was delivered. Obviously these days site welfare makes this more comfortable allowing us to expand to whatever timescale is appropriate for the level of training being delivered.
Therefore, the only difference between toolbox talks and a longer training session would be the venue. Not having to removed operatives from site has serious financial implications too.
Of course everyone is entitled to their opinion, but this is my train of thought regarding this!
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Rank: Super forum user
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I think that people are missing the point about tool box talks where such talks are lasting for more than 20 mins at the very max as after a very few mins people lose interest and the prompts/training turns from positive to negative as, in my view, tool box talks which can take 1 min, 10 min's etc. and they are back up interactive prompt talks to proper training only and any training with suggested renewal dates e.g. renew every 5 years, needs to be backed up on a regular basis by tool box talks
U cannot get away from proper training and yep it may initially seem costly etc. but its cheaper in the long run and U are more sure that staff have been trained to a good standard and can prove this in a court more easily
Personally I use the 'approved' training parameters myself albeit I personally ensure that no unnecessary areas are put into the training sessions to bulk it up
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Bob
I agree in some cases that this can happen with tool box talks. However, they can also be run effectively and keep people engaged. I have run training for running training before which looks at how to keep people interested and how to plan training sessions to ensure that people get the most that they can out of them.
In short, I firmly believe that the right content, delivered in the right way will keep about 85% of people engaged and happy (the other 15% will be those who really, really are not interested!).
But....
this is straying from the original topic! I agree that the proper training will always be easier to defend with but the question was will the toolbox talk suffice so far as the legal requirements for asbestos awareness training, to which from the replies so far, I suppose the answer is yes!
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Rank: Super forum user
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ashley.willson wrote:But, as I said, a toolbox talk can last any length of time (although we run a minimum of 30 mins as this makes it claimable through CITB!). The only reason for running mine at 45 mins to 1 hour (currently) is that I run it every year, where Pauls lasts for 5 years! Toolbox talk training is simply training that runs on site. The name comes from site workers sitting on their toolbox while the training was delivered. Obviously these days site welfare makes this more comfortable allowing us to expand to whatever timescale is appropriate for the level of training being delivered.
Therefore, the only difference between toolbox talks and a longer training session would be the venue. Not having to removed operatives from site has serious financial implications too.
Of course everyone is entitled to their opinion, but this is my train of thought regarding this! Quite correct, Ashley. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. I would say having people on a training course with a booklet consisting of the course notes so they can double check or query something themselves and having a test with a pass rate of 80% is more conducive to learning but that's just my opinion. I also believe we never find out if there has been suitable and sufficient training until it goes pear shaped...as Bob pointed out with proof in court comment. Good luck with your choice.
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