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sholland  
#1 Posted : 08 December 2014 16:33:01(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
sholland

Hi, I am on the look out for a decent Fire Risk Assessment Form/template which would be suitable for me to use at the primary school where i work, circa: 400 children, 90 staff, 4 different buildings...any ideas ??? Many thanks in advance, Syd
JohnW  
#2 Posted : 08 December 2014 16:44:42(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
JohnW

sholland, I don't wish to appear harsh or critical but That is one helluva responsibility to write a fire risk assessment for premises that have 400 children, 90 staff, 4 different buildings for you to say ... any ideas? suggests to me that you do not have the competence to complete this assessment You need a safety professional with experience in schools I have 7 years experience conducting fire risk assessments in factories but I would not feel competent to conduct an assessment for a large school. Get professional help, not a template from an internet forum. John
firesafety101  
#3 Posted : 08 December 2014 17:20:45(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

I wonder if this is a case of the Head nominating one of the staff to carry out the FRA without having enough knowledge of regulations to know the competence required, and the nominated person simply saying Yes ?
sholland  
#4 Posted : 08 December 2014 17:33:46(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
sholland

Thanks very much for the responses. It seems I obviously havent been completely clear with my situation, I am a competent health and safety professional with over 5 yrs experience across both the Fire and Construction sectors. This experience was key to getting the role of Site Manager responsible for H&S and Fire Management within the School, it is also a good learning curve working within an organisation rather than advising from the outside. I am simply looking for a more usable Fire Risk Assesment Form and was hoping my fellow members may be able to help me with some different options re forms/templates
JohnW  
#5 Posted : 08 December 2014 17:37:52(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
JohnW

That thought did occur to me too FS. Do schools get guidance from the local authorities with regard to what safety management tasks their staff can do and when they need to get consultants for H&S and fire safety? I hope Syd (sholland) comes back and is not frightened off by our responses. He does need help and can get it here if he enters into the discussion. John
JohnW  
#6 Posted : 08 December 2014 17:40:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
JohnW

Sorry Syd, our posts crossed. I worked out my own fire risk assessment template onto an excel spreadsheet, using the PAS79 guidance, nine step process of asking the right questions. John
firesafety101  
#7 Posted : 08 December 2014 18:55:26(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

Where I live the LEA have a H&S Manager who assists schools with their requirements, fire risk assessment, risk assessment etc. I did have a disagreement with her over her poor quality COSHH assessment a few years ago when my wife was working for one of the schools. Regarding FRA I made my template many years ago using the regulations as a guide, just split up the assessment into bite size chunks. IMHO a FRA is the same process for every situation. Unless they bring a FRA for Schools don't treat in any different, however the life risk can br tricky depending on the ages of the children, and don't forget to do the PEEPSs as required.
toe  
#8 Posted : 08 December 2014 19:16:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
toe

I would go down the lines of pas79:2007 and pas7:2013. But do not use the pas79 template as a tick box exercise, in which I think it can be. Your assessment should make you think about the requirements and to be able to document items for improvements or actions. In my experience the Fire and Rescue Service tend to recognise and like the pas79 paperwork format as well.
JohnW  
#9 Posted : 08 December 2014 19:56:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
JohnW

FS, I would certainly find an assessment for a large school tricky, I'll stick with factories :o) Toe, yes I found the PAS79 principles very useful, avoiding box-ticking, designing the assessment to ask questions, to make you and the manager, or whoever, think about possible fire scenarios etc., put in answers and also think about improvements. I haven't looked at PAS7:2013.
bob youel  
#10 Posted : 08 December 2014 22:23:10(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

Also read education laws with regards to schools as there are things in there which are extra/different to the RR(FS)O etc. which need to be accounted for as they carry weight and PAS79 is OK as a base line only in my view [noting that most of such things are tick boxes as against real risk assessments as already noted [some PSA79 examples I have seen, which have cost schools lots of dosh are very poor indeed!] If in doubt contact your local Fire & Rescue Service safety officers as i find most are very helpful and for the first assessment get in a specialist and shadow as we all have to learn and we are not expert in all areas noting that if anything untoward happens its on your head
alistair  
#11 Posted : 09 December 2014 09:36:59(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
alistair

I too have used PAS79 2012 as the basis for risk assessments in 14 school buildings with sleeping accommodation and I am currently using it to do another 30+ classroom buildings over the next year. I find it a very useful guide and the Fire Service Officers (who have recently inspected the majority of our premises) are happy with the format. Never heard of PAS 7 2013!
SBH  
#12 Posted : 09 December 2014 09:48:44(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
SBH

Have you considered doing 4 separate assessments - 1 for each building, and then combine issues in the action plans. If you need a template PM me and I will dig one out. SBH
David Bannister  
#13 Posted : 09 December 2014 09:58:09(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
David Bannister

Check your inbox.
creative2  
#14 Posted : 09 December 2014 11:24:59(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
creative2

It would be helpful to know if it is an academy/independent school or an LEA school? the responsibilities differ. I support 5 academies and have completed several fire risk assessments for their premises. A template is fine but please do not fall into the trap of relying on the format instead of really looking and identifying the hazards and issues. Have you got a copy of the Government publication "Fire Safety Risk Assessment for educational premises"? There is a free download available and there is one covering disabled issues as well amongst others for factories etc. There are templates on the WWW if that is waht suits you. If you want some more assistance PM me. ARB
firesafety101  
#15 Posted : 09 December 2014 13:06:06(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

sholland wrote:
Hi, I am on the look out for a decent Fire Risk Assessment Form/template which would be suitable for me to use at the primary school where i work, circa: 400 children, 90 staff, 4 different buildings...any ideas ??? Many thanks in advance, Syd
I think we need to keep on seeing the question so I am using the quote facility. As suggested, and IMHO you should do four separate assessments, one for each of the buildings and only combine them if there is an evacuation of all buildings on operation of the fire alarm in any one building. I have never used PAS79 as I feel the rrfso adequate and easy to follow. If sleeping risk then use the guide "sleeping accommodation" https://www.gov.uk/gover...eeping-accommodation.pdf and https://www.gov.uk/gover...educational-premises.pdf There will be a need for COSHH, maybe DSEAR and other risk assessments, and you may need further help if unfamiliar with fra's ?
Waz  
#16 Posted : 16 December 2014 07:49:48(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Waz

I have a specific form which allows fire risk assessment to be conducted throughout the establishment, accounting for all parties and has been useful in raising awareness when presenting to a college and kindergarten here in Oman. If you would like a copy, then warren.fothergill@btinternet.com is the email to get me on.
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