Rank: Forum user
|
Hi all,
The above has come my way, a medium sized builder has asked me about it.
Its seems although not legal requirement it is considered best practice to have a trained works co ordinator on site.
The builder has got competant managers on site who carry out daily checks across the sites, (up to 8 houses) however a TW co oprdinater appears to need in depth knowledge of such as crane bases, shuttering, scaffold, ground suitability etc etc.
Anyone else advised on this?
|
|
|
|
Rank: Forum user
|
Monticello
On a previous Project that I was involved with the HSE insisted that we employed a Temporary Works Coordinator, and they referred us to BS 5975. The standard is very useful and section 7 specifically covers the appointment and responsibilities of both temporary works coordinators and temporary works supervisors. This would be a good starting point for you.
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
russ pt wrote:Monticello
On a previous Project that I was involved with the HSE insisted that we employed a Temporary Works Coordinator, and they referred us to BS 5975. The standard is very useful and section 7 specifically covers the appointment and responsibilities of both temporary works coordinators and temporary works supervisors. This would be a good starting point for you.
I know nothing about construction but I am interested in H&S law and how it is enforced. So how can the HSE ‘insist’ on you having a Temporary Works Coordinator, when it is not a legal requirement? As we all know British Standards are just advice/best practice so what did the HSE say?
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
A Kurdziel
The below is taken from the BS website. Also there is information on HSE websire re the fact that compliance with some BS (british standard and not the other kind of BS) is a legal requirement. Dont know whether this is applicable in this case though.
"Standard means "something that is generally accepted". A British Standard Publication is a document that has been produced by the BSI as a technical specification or practice to be used as a guideline for the standard production of a product, or the carrying out of a process, such as testing or providing a service.
British Standards are not generally used as law or to impose regulations; but are rather designed to be used voluntarily to help manufacturers, users and consumers. However, some laws or legal regulations do make compliance with a British or ISO standard compulsory."
|
|
|
|
Rank: Forum user
|
To quote from the HSE website;
British Standard 5975 sets out one way of managing temporary works (TW) that has been found to work well on medium and large projects and uses the job title Temporary Works Coordinator (TWC). There is no legal requirement to use this job title or the BS recommended process, but you should remember that BS5975 provides an industry consensus view on what is considered to be good practice. The legal requirement is that the party in control must ensure that work is allocated and carried out in a manner that does not create unacceptable risk of harm to workers or members of the public. On projects with relatively simple TW needs, you may choose not to appoint a TWC. However, you must still make sure that TW are properly managed to ensure safety.
So you don't legally need to appoint one, however if you have an accident that is investigated by the HSE they'll ask what you did to ensure you met the 'industry consensus view' on temporary works...
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
So it’s down to the HSE inspectors to decide which standards apply?
Some technical standards are essentially legal requirements eg some of the electrical stuff.
Some are just advice and you are not really expected to comply for example the standard describing first aid. Every so often a supplier of first kits says:
”Oh! The BS for first aid has changed and so you must buy a whole set of new complaint first kits”, when all you need to do is to comply with the regs.
Then we have this stuff in between, where it’s not clear if the standard is a legal requirement.
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
Should a project have a problem and U end up in a court/civil claim then U would have to demonstrate best practice and adhering to such standards is taken as best practice hence they are used, so whilst the HSE cannot legally insist on U using them U are best taking heed
NB: Everything is becoming a money generating thing inclusive of the use of such standards/guides and its incidental if a worker is made safe etc. because of such standards, however we will never get around that area - blame the barristers, solicitors, insurers and accountants not the H&S bods!!
|
|
|
|
Rank: Forum user
|
When I started my new role last year the company I joined had no knowledge of temporary works and the roles of a co-ordinator or supervisor. In-house, we do not have the expertise to act as a TWC so this is undertaken by an external structural engineer. All of our site managers attended a TWS course which suited our needs. In reality, the TW we come across is hoarding and the occasional scaffold and propping. I have seen since we did our course that the CITB now run TWC and TWS courses that will probably become the minimum requirement for the UKCG.
|
|
|
|
Rank: Forum user
|
A Kurdziel, in reply.
The project in question was a very large project on a COMAH top tier site. We had early and regular interventions with the CA along with the Construction Inspectors from the HSE (Field Operations Directorate). At the early interventions and meetings they raised the management of temporary works but not specifically the appointment of a TWC. This process was built into the construction phase plan and several months later on a site visit, when construction had began, it's operation was demonstrated on part of the project and they were satisfied.
Sub-contractors were required to appoint a TWC or TWS and these would then liaise on a weekly basis with the work-stream lead for that part of the project, the work-stream leads in turn met regularly with the project manager, principal contractor, designers and each other.
As the project activity progressed and the amount of temporary works and sub-contractors involved with temporary works increased they became more insistent on there being a single TWC liaising with the sub-contractors TWC/TWS.
Whereas I agree it is a standard and not a requirement of legislation such as CDM, but it is recognised good practice and applying the standard demonstrates a level of control that satisfies the regulator.
The Client for the project was also the PC and CDMC, albeit designated individuals, and so this may have played a part in their decision making?
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
Quote=Russ pt]A Kurdziel, in reply.
The project in question was a very large project on a COMAH top tier site. We had early and regular interventions with the CA along with the Construction Inspectors from the HSE (Field Operations Directorate). At the early interventions and meetings they raised the management of temporary works but not specifically the appointment of a TWC. This process was built into the construction phase plan and several months later on a site visit, when construction had began, it's operation was demonstrated on part of the project and they were satisfied.
Sub-contractors were required to appoint a TWC or TWS and these would then liaise on a weekly basis with the work-stream lead for that part of the project, the work-stream leads in turn met regularly with the project manager, principal contractor, designers and each other.
As the project activity progressed and the amount of temporary works and sub-contractors involved with temporary works increased they became more insistent on there being a single TWC liaising with the sub-contractors TWC/TWS.
Whereas I agree it is a standard and not a requirement of legislation such as CDM, but it is recognised good practice and applying the standard demonstrates a level of control that satisfies the regulator.
The Client for the project was also the PC and CDMC, albeit designated individuals, and so this may have played a part in their decision making?
Thanks for the explanation that makes sense now
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.