I would be interested to hear experienced consultants views of this... When you visit potential clients and identify that there are a number of risks present, some of which is a direct breach of their statutory duties, how do you encourage them to use your services? If not, how is it ethical that you don't take further action, knowing that there are person/s at risk?

wturner, I have encountered this situation several times. It's never a case that I "don't take further action" - I always document my findings and provide clients with hard copy and electronic copy. The next action is up to the client. In a few cases, small factories, I've been employed as safety adviser to do risk assessments, and with machinery I usually start off doing PUWER assessments as this quickly finds any issues with the controls, interlocks etc., so the client gets documents from me that explain any breaches to regs e.g. no guarding or interlocks are disabled (found this several times). If they don't want to fix that problem I suggest they get advice from their insurance company as in the event of an accident they might find the policy won't pay up - don't know if that would happen but the mere mention of insurance has gotten some clients to take the right approach with regard to dangerous machines and interlocks. On small building sites where I've been asked to do CDM-C or to be a safety adviser again published site inspections will be a record of any findings, so I have taken that action, and the next action is up to the site manager. I have on occasion walked away if the site manager has not taken my advice e.g. on scaffolding, work at height, dust masks etc. That has 'cost me' sometimes when I hadn't yet been paid for a previous visit :o) The important thing to do is to get your findings down in writing and to give the client or site manager copy of documents - electronic/e-mail preferably, as he can throw away hard copy. The safety adviser must cover his backside! JohnW

Are U saying that you evaluate some aspects of a company before U have formally been commissioned to act for the company concerned? And if U find something wrong without being commissioned thereafter U then report negative findings to the HSE/EHO's or are U asking; should a H&S person where they have not been commissioned report findings tho the authorities? With all due respect this is a business situation and we should do noting unless we are getting paid to do it and H&S people are not evangelists so we should act from that point and as for me I try to keep my ethical standard to the same high standard set by our MP's and similar My advice is to treat this area as a business and nothing else - best of luck