This is copied from the legislation, see para d,

Emergency routes and exits

14. (1) Where necessary in order to safeguard the safety of relevant persons, the responsible person must ensure that routes to emergency exits from premises and the exits themselves are kept clear at all times.

(2) The following requirements must be complied with in respect of premises where necessary (whether due to the features of the premises, the activity carried on there, any hazard present or any other relevant circumstances) in order to safeguard the safety of relevant persons—

(a)emergency routes and exits must lead as directly as possible to a place of safety;
(b)in the event of danger, it must be possible for persons to evacuate the premises as quickly and as safely as possible;
(c)the number, distribution and dimensions of emergency routes and exits must be adequate having regard to the use, equipment and dimensions of the premises and the maximum number of persons who may be present there at any one time;
(d)emergency doors must open in the direction of escape;
(e)sliding or revolving doors must not be used for exits specifically intended as emergency exits;
(f)emergency doors must not be so locked or fastened that they cannot be easily and immediately opened by any person who may require to use them in an emergency;
(g)emergency routes and exits must be indicated by signs; and
(h)emergency routes and exits requiring illumination must be provided with emergency lighting of adequate intensity in the case of failure of their normal lighting.

Agree with David, Fire Officer has accepted this, where the travel of the door is against the flow of escape due to the low number of likely users in the event of fire.

Pete,

Fully agree, FS101.

And that is a good illustration as to why a fire risk assessment needs to be done by someone who fully understands the subject and is capable of making a decision based on their professional judgement, rather than slavishly following a rule book.

Final exit door is a door for use in an emergency therefore see 'd' in the list I provided.

Mssy, I have no wish to start an argument, I am now too old for that having started to pick up my old age pension, but still interested in these threads, however para 14 (1) of the Legislation begins with where necessary but para d does not therefore I would think it is mandatory for exit doors to open in the direction of escape.

Having said that your post is very interesting and does show what measures can be achieved if you really want to, you do mention outward opening doors?

Bob on Mssy,

I know of a few premises where it is accepted that final exit doors do not open in the direction of travel, one a large relatively new public building where the exits (large steel doors) lead onto busy public walkways - liable to collide with pedestrians when opened in a hurry and another in a care home (low numbers of likely users), both with the approval of the Enforcement Authority - The Local Fire Brigade and CQC for the care home.

Pete,

ha ha ha - where X or current Fire Officers collide (im guessing here of course but there are enough clues)

Fire safety your round mate?

Im getting this all the time with many debates - I have a well established PAP for safety and I entered one for fire safety and get two FO's is a debate it is great.......... But what you learn is immense.....

Add "where" to "neccessary" and it becomes a sentence with a different meaning.

To the pub with you immediately, wallet in hand, haha!

Pete,

Re doors opening out onto the pavement, I have been involved in recommending lobbying arrangements to get the doors away from the pavement.

It works if you have the want to get it done but understand it is difficult with expensive doors and listed buildings.

ok then for the sake of consistency of the debate lets apply 'interpretation' - drink up?

Yes it is now Friday :o) mssy, your comment above brought to my mind Eric Morecambe and Andre Previn



or was it Andrew Preview?

:o))

I know one thing the final exits in my local don't open in the direction of travel and i'm sure I have been impared in my ability or want to escape when leaving on occassion, haha!!!

Pete,

As indicated in some ACoPs, I tend to regard both 'must' and 'shall' as mandatory (though in this case because they say 'where necessary' that allows for some interpretation and differing opinion).

If I read guidance that says 'should' I tend to think of it as not mandatory, but suggested best practice, and in court you might have to explain when/why you didn't use the suggested best practice.

On another note....

Last year the council built a ground level 6 bedded care facility to be predominately used with wheelchair users and to be registered as a HMO. I was instructed to complete the first initial FRA and to advise on signage and fire fighting equipment. All the final exits opened inwards which was ludicrous because of the wheelchair users. My concerns were raised with the council and the Fire and Rescue Service quoting section 13 of The Fire Safety (Scotland) Act 2006. My advice was ignored and the Fire officer granted the HMO licence, despite me mentioning RosePark to him.

Note, All of my FRA's, documentation and communication is securely stored and evidenced just in case.

David, yes, but in premises with just say 7 able-bodied employees the manager can decide 'not necessary' and keep his inward-opening doors.

Decisions on vital safety features of buildings (and legistave requirements) should not normally be made by managers. They should be made by fire safety professionals/engineers. This is one reason why healthcare premises get annual inspection's from the Fire and Rescue Services, etc... To ensure compliance with the Law.

I guess this thread is more about the wording and interpretation on the law than anything else, and this is how I see it.

Ideally final exits should open in the direction of flow, which can easily be achieved in new builds, however, if the door opens onto a public pathway or a roadway or the building is old or is a listed building or the building has low occupancy with fully abled bodies then it may not be a reasonable request to change these to opening outward.

"Decisions on vital safety features of buildings (and legistave requirements) should not normally be made by managers. They should be made by fire safety professionals/engineers."

Fair point Toe, I can recall 3 companies who had inward opening fire doors at a main reception and which were signed off by the Council Fire Officer. They would be considered as fire safety professionals.

Regards

Pressures not pleasures- Dohhhhh