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Linda G  
#1 Posted : 19 January 2015 14:43:59(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Linda G

We have a noise problem in our welding bay at one of our locations and need to reduce the levels. A contributing factor is that the floor has been covered with metal plates which seem to be causing reverberation increasing noise levels. When asked I was told that the metal had been laid to stop sparks from welding bouncing off the concrete floors and hitting the operator. I am not an expert in welding but feel that this cannot be right as the many welding operations I have seen have all been within an environment with concrete flooring. Can anybody advise me the best flooring for welding operations and if concrete can cause such problems? Many thanks Linda
wturner  
#2 Posted : 19 January 2015 15:00:16(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
wturner

Hi Linda, We have a number of welding bays, all with concrete floors, with a variety of welding operations. I would imagine it's MIG welding being carried out? I cannot see how metal flooring would assist. If this was my workshop, I would remove the metal flooring to expose the concrete and provide PPE for the bouncing sparks. This would be normal practice in most workshops.
Linda G  
#3 Posted : 19 January 2015 17:32:40(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Linda G

Thank you Wturner - yes MIG mostly.
chris42  
#4 Posted : 20 January 2015 15:46:15(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

I also used to work for a company that was involved with heavy steel fabrication, so lots of welding. Concrete floors everywhere. The men had safety boots, flame retardant overalls, weld gauntlets and masks all as standard. Mig, submerged arc, oxy/acetylene cutting, arc air, grinding processes all with concrete floors (if they were lucky). If I was a cynical person I may wonder if the steel plate was put on the floor because the concrete was not in good condition and it was quicker (less production down time) to put steel plate down. I really can't see it would help. Chris
Linda G  
#5 Posted : 20 January 2015 16:00:06(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Linda G

Thanks Chris - its a new build so should not be a damaged floor but perhaps because management wanted to keep the pristine condition! Anyway I shall advise them to remove it and ensure correct PPE is worn.
paul.skyrme  
#6 Posted : 20 January 2015 21:58:48(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
paul.skyrme

OK, I would not agree with the steel plate flooring. However, I have always been taught, and, it seems that official guidance always puts PPE as the last resort, not least of all because it always fails to danger? Yes I AM familiar with welding processes, many, and, more than perhaps I would like. So, I would look as to why I was thinking about recommending the least safe method of operator protection?
toe  
#7 Posted : 20 January 2015 22:59:08(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
toe

I might be off the mark here - but is there a such a thing as a fire retardant safety mat, that will stop the welding sparks from bouncing up and may also act as an acoustic damper and fatigue for the worker. One stone and three birds down. Just a thought. On another note, I did some work in a welding shop some time ago with respect to noise, and found that the aluminium extractor system was one culprit in which we placed stick on sound deadening material on the ducting and capture hoods and also re-located the motor to outside the building. We also replaced the welding curtains with a heaver plastic type material which also helped to deaden the sound. Paul is right, PPE = last resort, however, what I concluded with the work I done, it was Ok do all the standard stuff to reduce the overall noise levels, in which we did achieve, the problem is that the ears are close to the welding torch in which it's difficult to prevent/manage the sound travelling the short distance to the ears without the use of hearing protection.
Jane Blunt  
#8 Posted : 21 January 2015 10:19:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Jane Blunt

Another little thought has popped into my head - by putting metal plates on the floor, you may have created a conductive environment. This raises the risk of electrocution of your welders. I would definitely not recommend metal flooring for welding. Sparks will bounce off metal just as well as from concrete in any event. I would go for concrete.
toe  
#9 Posted : 21 January 2015 23:08:13(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
toe

Actually the metal suppresses the sparks, and any molten metal or slag from the welding process will stick to the metal whereas it just bounces off concrete. The floor plates could be the earth bonding for the prosess just like the (metal) welding benches would be, especially as it has been suggested that it could be MIG welding. However, you are correct - most imdustrial welders are 3 phase power supply and if the metal plate were to become live - curly hair all round.
Jane Blunt  
#10 Posted : 22 January 2015 08:23:06(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Jane Blunt

The return connection should be as close to the live as possible. There is a real risk of electrocution from the normal open circuit voltage of the set, in a conductive environment. I recall a case of a welder killer by the OCV of his set about 15 years ago. He appears to have made accidental contact via his head. Now in this case we only have the floor made from metal, but how many other objects in the environment are electrically connected to it, inadvertently? You can get special welding sets suitable for conductive environments - they have a letter 'S' on the rating plate, and have a restricted OCV. Please see the HSE page: http://www.hse.gov.uk/welding/electrocution.htm Metal sparks will bounce off metal btw. You only have to look through a suite of images of welding to see the evidence.
johnmurray  
#11 Posted : 22 January 2015 11:22:35(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
johnmurray

Are you sure it was not made so, to reduce the down-time of having to replace the return lead when the workpiece is moved? Apart from the welding head, the return lead is the most likely to be damaged. It sounds like an employer idea to reduce working time on the job... The other usual reason is to reduce floor damage, caused by moving the workpiece, especially if the method is the turning by use of a steel lever. Bad idea, because of the electrocution problem. What bouncing-sparks problem? Are your welders not equipped with flame resistant coveralls as standard?
toe  
#12 Posted : 24 January 2015 11:49:25(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
toe

Well thought of John - possibly the most likley reason for the floor plates.
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