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seorasb  
#1 Posted : 15 December 2015 19:54:26(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
seorasb

Does a builder working from his own home and using his garage as a store for low risk items; access equipment mostly, no HFL or LPG require a Fire Risk Assessment for this. Less than 5 employees. Well ordered and controlled, gated access .
David Bannister  
#2 Posted : 16 December 2015 08:22:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
David Bannister

Yes. Does it have to be written down on many pages of A4 to a set format? Certainly not. Does it have to be carried out by an expensive consultant? No again. Can he do it himself? Yes, almost certainly by looking around, identifying any sources of ignition, doing whatever he can (reasonably do) to remove these and then deciding if he needs to do anything else to reduce the risk.
JohnW  
#3 Posted : 17 December 2015 10:17:58(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
JohnW

seorasb, As indicated by David your fire risk assessment should not be difficult to do. I advice having a written document if you ever have suppliers or customers coming onto your premises.
seorasb  
#4 Posted : 20 December 2015 11:50:55(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
seorasb

Thanks, all done now.
bob youel  
#5 Posted : 20 December 2015 17:18:29(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

with all due respect & without being funny etc. in any way do U really think that an average builder is competent to undertake a suitable and sufficient risk assessment for any subject? no wonder H&S appears to have gone to the dogs
mssy  
#6 Posted : 21 December 2015 10:32:44(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
mssy

The OP referred to the use of a lock up garage for storing low risk builders materials and tools. I would say any Builder could do a reasonable job at such a low risk simple premises. I am not sure why you think Builders are so thick Bob, some can even write and use a knife & fork :)
gramsay  
#7 Posted : 21 December 2015 15:19:57(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
gramsay

Back in September I made a thorough survey of subcontractors' information supplied to several sites. Some subbies had many thousands of employees and some were small 3 - 5 person operations. By some distance the best risk assessment / method statement pack was from a sole trader specialising in dry stone walling, with a couple of self-employed assistants. I spoke to him for some time to thank him for the effort he'd put in - this is a guy who's worked outside manually all his life, and he had the sense of responsibility to properly find out what he would need to do, and to put that on paper in a way which told us everything we needed in advance of him getting to site. So, yes, being a builder doesn't mean rubbish risk assessments, and equally being a large company can still mean you get rubbish ones...
bob youel  
#8 Posted : 23 December 2015 09:10:04(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

again with all due respect I do not say that builders are thick I say that undertaking a suitable and sufficient [note the term = suitable and sufficient] risk assessment takes skill, effort, knowledge, understanding etc. e.g. competence and like others I have found that some [few] small builders are great and some large business are very poor and we should all concentrate on what we are competent at e.g. builders build and risk assessors facilitate my point is that if a small builder wants their accounts, roofing work, electrical work, national insurance, pensions etc. doing they get the right people in to do it for them so why should they not get H&S in as well? And if we continually say that risk assessment is easy [without the appropriate competence behind you] we may as well throw in the towel - I say best of luck to all competent builders and that they should stay in their competence zone
mssy  
#9 Posted : 23 December 2015 21:48:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
mssy

bob youel wrote:
again with all due respect I do not say that builders are thick I say that undertaking a suitable and sufficient [note the term = suitable and sufficient] risk assessment takes skill, effort, knowledge, understanding etc. e.g. competence and like others I have found that some [few] small builders are great and some large business are very poor and we should all concentrate on what we are competent at e.g. builders build and risk assessors facilitate my point is that if a small builder wants their accounts, roofing work, electrical work, national insurance, pensions etc. doing they get the right people in to do it for them so why should they not get H&S in as well? And if we continually say that risk assessment is easy [without the appropriate competence behind you] we may as well throw in the towel - I say best of luck to all competent builders and that they should stay in their competence zone
But the OP was referring to a garage storing builder's kit!!! Pretty low risk perhaps Do you expect a one-man band builder to task an expensive Fire Consultant to do this? Even SME builders have to supply method statements, risk assessments and the like when working on sites - especially if subbying to bigger organisations. Why on earth wouldn't s/he give it a go themselves. The law allows for DIY responses, indeed the Govt supply guidance and support for SMEs and Sole Traders. Sure it's all about size & risk, so a shed with tools = DIY The Shard in London = A competent person
bob youel  
#10 Posted : 24 December 2015 11:49:44(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bob youel

if a 1 man band kills, maims or otherwise really hurts somebody because of their actions/inaction then they are at the mercy of the court etc. and all the goverments marketing and politics about helping small business goes out of the window & the single trader stands alone - the same with tax & all other things as for expensive I do not buy it as a gas fitter, electrician, mechanic, plasterer, accountant, solicitor etc. that are used by 1 man bands usually charge more and are happily paid by these same 1 man bands I support one man bands [I was an SC60 tradesperson & I ran a limited company] all I am saying is that we should all stick to our own competences & if a one man band is in doubt then they should get themselves on a proper course as they willingly do for other aspects of their job best of luck to him & U -- sorry about the spelling in the last post?!
Invictus  
#11 Posted : 24 December 2015 12:03:24(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Invictus

I think he can do it himself as long as he checks any chemicals etc. Low risk environment, low risk solution. I think a court would be impressed that he had one and likely to reduce the fine.
bleve  
#12 Posted : 26 December 2015 12:44:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
bleve

At the end of the day, it is a lock up, described as being without hazardous materials. In this case a no brainer but Bob's point may well be valid in other circumstances.
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