Rank: Forum user 
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Hi,
Just after some opinions please
I am currently employed as an NVQ assessor in electrical/electronic engineering no problem there suitably qualified and competent in that area. I have however just been asked to NVQ assess welding which I am extremely uncomfortable with, as I have no competence in that area I have never undertaken welding of any description at all. I have said that if I was assessing welding I would want a competent person with me such as a supervisor mainly as a safety number as well as to provide technical advice and to perhaps sign a disclaimer that he takes responsibility for safety during the assessment due to a lack of competence on my part. I guess my query is that if things where to go wrong regarding safety whilst assessing where do I stand. I know there are other issues such as a poor learning/teaching experience and that the employer should employ a competent assessor but safety and the legal ramifications to me and my employer if it goes wrong is really my main concern and is what I am seeking your views on. I know what my own views are and that I should not do it Your thoughts please
Thanks in advance
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Rank: Super forum user 
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As an assessor you are there to observe the work process and assess whether the work being carried out meets the standards. As an assessor you are a visitor on site and do not have any more responsibility for the candidates H&S than any other person on site, and far less than their employers.
However, part of the NVQ (I think a whole unit) should be to assess H&S practices.
Your issue is more to do with the fact that you are not 'occupationally competent' to assess these trainee welders. You are the assessor and should decide what is right, and what you are prepared to put your name to. Also, when the EV comes to visit he may need some answers.
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Rank: Forum user
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Hi Watson,
Thanks for your reply and your points are undoubtedly valid but I am thinking along the lines of section 3 of HSAWA and the common law duty of care to provide safe and competent employees. So if a learner is harmed whilst I am assessing a subject in which I am occupationally incompetent to assess I would think that both my employer and myself would have a case to answer.
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Rank: Super forum user
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M In my view you are showing competence and professionalism in addressing this issue on this site and you should be commended for that & I wish that there were more like U
I agree & advise that the only person that should appraise an NVQ [H&S areas or otherwise] is a person that is competent to do so e.g. they should know the difference between stove pipe and conventional welding? & I also agree that if a problem occurred such as a trainee recieving an electric shock [which is well known in the welding field] or even electrocution [which is foreseeable] then U may be called to book especially in such a high risk area I would let your employer manage the issues with the client
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Rank: Forum user
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Hi Bob,
Thanks for taking the time to reply and for your sound advice. I am most definitely on the same wavelength as yourself.
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Rank: Forum user
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I maybe wrong but from my experience with NVQ Assessors you need to apply to your awarding body and be accredited by them to assess a particular qualification; part of this accreditation process is proving your competence in the subject for the NVQ in question and if you can't provide evidence of your competence your awarding body will not approve you to assess that qualification. This is at least how it worked with the awarding body that my previous employers were accredited under.
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Rank: Forum user
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fscott wrote:I maybe wrong but from my experience with NVQ Assessors you need to apply to your awarding body and be accredited by them to assess a particular qualification; part of this accreditation process is proving your competence in the subject for the NVQ in question and if you can't provide evidence of your competence your awarding body will not approve you to assess that qualification. This is at least how it worked with the awarding body that my previous employers were accredited under. Hi fscott, Thanks for taking the time to reply Where I work has self accreditation of which NVQ's I can assess, but as you rightly said the awarding body can always scrutinise which qualifcations I am assessing to determine my competence. I am aware of the issues regarding awarding bodies and teaching and learning experience etc. My main concern though is what if anything goes wrong and injury results to the learner and what the legal ramifcations are. I am pretty sure I know what could be the legal ramifications and this has been confirmed in an earlier post on this thread Cheers
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Rank: Forum user
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There are so many pitfalls here. Centres just adding assessors to schemes as a marriage of convenience is wholly wrong, (if that is the case) If a centre has 'self accreditation' then yes it can manage its teams, but only as far as the schemes and standards allow. There is an issue that some awarding bodies don't visit now as much, we have annual visits, and it is possible for a lot of damage to be done in the meantime. You are right to be concerned about your duty of care but it shouldn't get to that. Scheme books will be clear about the competencies required, I urge you to check the standards required for that scheme against what you feel you are competent and capable of, and don't exceed that.
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Rank: Forum user
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I worked as an SVQ assessor for the last 3.5 years. As I understand it you must have a 'claim to competence' to satisfy the awarding body before assessment can take place and be verified. It is certainly something a verifier will look for.
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Rank: Forum user
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Hi
I'm an NVQ Assessor and would only be comfortable doing assessment in L3 & L5 in Occupational Health & Safety (as a CMIOSH practitioner, I think this is reasonable to assume competency). However, to assess activities for which you are 'not competent' is not ethical. If you are assessing a particular unit e.g. H&S then you could support this if you are qualified in H&S.
Last year I had a conversation with an EV and we re-iterated that subject matter experts are what is required for each subject area - so welding, electrics etc. I wouldn't go near; however in reviewing policies and procedures for H&S yes, no problem.
Remember if you are a member of IOSH, then there is the Ethics policy you have to abide.
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Rank: Forum user
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Hi All,
I would just like to say thanks to everyone for taking the time and effort to reply to my query. You all raised some valid points and where most definetly on the same wavelength as myself
Kindest Regards
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Rank: Super forum user 
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Waz wrote:Hi
I'm an NVQ Assessor and would only be comfortable doing assessment in L3 & L5 in Occupational Health & Safety (as a CMIOSH practitioner, I think this is reasonable to assume competency). However, to assess activities for which you are 'not competent' is not ethical. If you are assessing a particular unit e.g. H&S then you could support this if you are qualified in H&S.
Last year I had a conversation with an EV and we re-iterated that subject matter experts are what is required for each subject area - so welding, electrics etc. I wouldn't go near; however in reviewing policies and procedures for H&S yes, no problem.
Remember if you are a member of IOSH, then there is the Ethics policy you have to abide. Why do you assume being CMIOSH is a level of compentcy, I don't there are too many who assme this and it is rubbish. Just because people can stand in front of a group of people who believe they are better than everyone else does not prove competency. Being a good practitioner is much more than this but hey, shout it enough times and people believe it. The number of CMIOSH holders I have come across who are less competent than infant kids is amazing but they still like to wave that little card in your face and say 'but i'm CMIOSH' is amazing. There are a lot who have CMIOSH who are competent but assuming all are is a mistake. I am working towards it but not because I believe it makes me competent as I already know I am and don't need an institute to tell me but because there are too many brainwashed companies who believe that this is the route to true enlightment.
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Rank: Super forum user
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INVICTUS
was said "I'm an NVQ Assessor and would only be comfortable doing assessment in L3 & L5 in Occupational Health & Safety (as a CMIOSH practitioner, I think this is reasonable to assume competency).""
It is reasonable comment..if he is not someone could report to IOSH with objective evidence and will be handled by IOSH according code of conduct..
I am not either working for IOSH and NEBOSH but below statements by you a bit strange
""I am working towards it but not because I believe it makes me competent as I already know I am and don't need an institute to tell me but because there are too many brainwashed companies who believe that this is the route to true enlightment"""
Why you still want to get CMIOSH ?? I think every Chartered Member knew his limitations based on Code of Conduct..
SHV
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Rank: Super forum user
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It was Mark Twain who once said: "it ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so."
Health and Safety is an enormously broad topic. No one person can know everything about every aspect. The problem arises when you think you know enough but don't. I operate in just one small area of occupational health and safety - and have done so now for 36 years. It is not unusual for me that when a new client approaches me with a problem I find that, with the best intentions, the action that had been taken with the best of intention was was inappropriate and had actually contributed to the problem. The person who implemented the system is sometimes CMIOSH, but was simply not aware of the many myths and much misinformation that exists in my particular area.
CMIOSH does not, in my experience, automatically confer competency in any one specific area of health and safety. (Puts flak jacket and tin hat one!)
Chris
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Rank: Super forum user
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SHV wrote:INVICTUS
was said "I'm an NVQ Assessor and would only be comfortable doing assessment in L3 & L5 in Occupational Health & Safety (as a CMIOSH practitioner, I think this is reasonable to assume competency).""
It is reasonable comment..if he is not someone could report to IOSH with objective evidence and will be handled by IOSH according code of conduct..
I am not either working for IOSH and NEBOSH but below statements by you a bit strange
""I am working towards it but not because I believe it makes me competent as I already know I am and don't need an institute to tell me but because there are too many brainwashed companies who believe that this is the route to true enlightment"""
Why you still want to get CMIOSH ?? I think every Chartered Member knew his limitations based on Code of Conduct..
SHV
I explain why!
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