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Posted By April Catherine Harvey
My current empolyer has fire ponits that are key activated.The suggetion is now that we do not issue the key to staff but conduct a risk assessment to assertain if fires are still detected and reported without the use of the fire call point.
Advice on this would be most welcome please.
April
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Posted By John Webster
I presume that you must be in an area where conventional call points would be constantly activated by others.
If your staff no longer have the means to activate the alarm, just how do you propose that the alarm is raised? For example, do you have automatic fire detection (smoke/heat/flame)? Why do you want to remove the keys anyway?
If this is an area occupied by other vulnerable people, or a public area, I think you need to discuss your plans with the local fire brigade.
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Posted By April Catherine Harvey
Thank you,I work in a prison that is why we have a key call point .We do have smoke detectors,however the system is new and I am not sure how safe that system is.I have been told that staff can use the phone or radio to alert us to fire.
Thank you
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Posted By Frank Hallett
Good afternoon April.
Prisons and fire safety are always a contentious issue and it isn't easy to apply the standard answers.
Given your original and subsequent posts, it appears that you aren't in a lower category site.
Without further specific info about the perceived causes underlying the decision, it is difficult to provide complete answers.
However, I could develop an arguement that the use of the key by an investigating officer may be less effective than the use of the radio because the key requires the officer to access the key-point whereas the radio can allow the officer to be anywhere.
Of course, it would also be fairly easy to develop an arguement that demonstrates that the radio is less reliable because the fire could affect the base or repeater stations by which the radio operates.
Personally, I would prefer to have both to hand so that I would know that I can warn with the minimum exposure to the danger of fire [and whoever started it, of course].
Frank Hallett
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Posted By April Catherine Harvey
Frank thank you for that.I am not sure why they do not want the keys to be issuesd as we have them in the office.
My concern is that not all staff have radios,and I am not to sure about how good the system is that we have heer as like all of us it is new.
Thanks
April
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Posted By Frank Hallett
Thanks for the additional stuff April.
You've really answered your own question now though! If not all persons likely to be in the position of havoing to confirm or initiate a fire alarm have radios; then they must have immediate access to the keys!
Good luck with unravelling any underlying logic that those who are considering the edict might have applied. I doubt that it's really sustainable.
Frank hallett
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Posted By Fred Pratley
As your alarm system is new, it would be worth involving the supplier, as modern systems are computers and are capable of interfacing with other systems via a modem.
If you have a personal attack system, it might be able to link to it. It is certainly possible on modern systems for the panel to telephone out information.
Your can have an inbuilt investigation delay, giving 5 minutes delay before sounders are activated etc, increase and decrease smoke detection sensitivity etc.
trust this is of some use
Fred
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Posted By April Catherine Harvey
Frank thank you,I have no idea of the logic behind this request.Will keep you all posted on the outcome.
APRIL
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Rank: Forum user
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Hello everyone.
We have just had our offices extended. The offices (and extension) have a fire system with smoke detectors and manual fire call points.
The manual fire call points in the extension are of a different type from the original ones. The original ones (installed only 5 years ago) are tested by means of pressing the pad and are then reset using a plastic key. The new ones are tested not by pressing the pad but by means of inserting a key (and which is a different key from the old one - it has two forks) - if you press the pad on the new ones to test the call point then the pad breaks and has to be replaced before the system can be reset.
I foresee that there will be confusion between the two types, resulting in the pads of the new call points being accidently broken during our weekly alarm tests.
My question is this - is it mandatory to have the new type? (I have researched the topic but cannot find anything of help).
My thought at present is to have consistency by changing the new call points to the old style.
Are there any fire safety experts who can point me in the right direction?
Thanks
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Rank: Super forum user 
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In the prison do the staff have keys to the doors and gates, handcuffs and anything else.
Why do they not have keys for the fire alam.
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Rank: Forum user
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Legbagman wrote:Hello everyone.
We have just had our offices extended. The offices (and extension) have a fire system with smoke detectors and manual fire call points.
The manual fire call points in the extension are of a different type from the original ones. The original ones (installed only 5 years ago) are tested by means of pressing the pad and are then reset using a plastic key. The new ones are tested not by pressing the pad but by means of inserting a key (and which is a different key from the old one - it has two forks) - if you press the pad on the new ones to test the call point then the pad breaks and has to be replaced before the system can be reset.
I foresee that there will be confusion between the two types, resulting in the pads of the new call points being accidently broken during our weekly alarm tests.
My question is this - is it mandatory to have the new type? (I have researched the topic but cannot find anything of help).
My thought at present is to have consistency by changing the new call points to the old style.
Are there any fire safety experts who can point me in the right direction?
Thanks
Legbagman
You may get more meaningful replies if you start a new thread with your question, rather than tagging it onto an 11year old zombie thread. Some posters may not read past the original post.
There are lots of very knowledgeable fire safety experts on this forum, such as Mssy (Messy) and Invictus who should be able to help you
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Rank: Forum user
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Thanks Watcher
I take your point. Perhaps I should have raised the issue in the member to member forum. I will copy it across in a moment.
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Rank: Moderator 
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Legbagman has opened a thread in the Member to Member Section - this thread is now closed
Mod 1
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