Rank: Forum user 
|
Recently at 2 different projects we have had non-negative testing results for opiates on routine drug and alcohol screening which is carried out as part of our safety induction process.
In both cases we then sent the test off to our UKAS accredited lab testing facility and the results received back both state "Specimen analysed by LCMS for opiates using the stated cut off. Results may be consistent with consumption of poppy seeds (non UKAS accredited comment)"
Has anyone else out there had issues with this? And how have you then managed the issue going forwards?
In the cases I have referred to both individuals consumed poppy seed bread so we advised them to refrain from eating this and then re-tested but this "glich" with a false non-negative result has caused lost time on site.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user 
|
I believe it caused a problem in a few prisons.
As an aside: if my employer tried to prevent me from consuming legal substances because their test procedures were deficient I soon tell them where to jump off.
You might review if you are exceeding your remit.
Certainly you are not doing the H&S community any favours by being heavy handed.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
This is a matter for the HR department, just because the test picked up opiates it doesn't mean that they are taking illegal highs. some prescribed drugs shows up in tests especially strong pain killers which are morphine based, which employees should declare before the test, but sometimes they don't say anything
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
Terry556 wrote:This is a matter for the HR department, just because the test picked up opiates it doesn't mean that they are taking illegal highs. some prescribed drugs shows up in tests especially strong pain killers which are morphine based, which employees should declare before the test, but sometimes they don't say anything Quite. I have just been advising a man (one of my wife's patients) who has been suspended (and is thus loosing money) because an idiot D&A screener would not document the fact he has a prescription for beta blockers. He now has to wait for the lab test to come back to confirm what was staring them in the face. He attended my wife's practice in tears. All caused by someone a bit full of themselves and a poor test protocol. The company is a big one that you will all know and maybe use, if you have gas.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user 
|
walker wrote:
The company is a big one that you will all know and maybe use, if you have gas.
I use Bicarbonate of Soda :-)
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
JohnMurray wrote:http://www.release.org.uk/law/drug-use-work
Join a union.
Contact solicitor if unwilling to join a union. I suggested both. I accompanied him to CAB as I have considerable experience with screening using the same kit as his employer. CAB were very helpful. He is now back at work but out of pocket: the company attitude to this is not encouraging.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user 
|
Many D&A policies pompously state things like "Zero tolerance" without stating "of what". Testing has come on hugely in the last 20 years and can now detect tiny levels in samples. Some good advice is, BEFORE getting tests done, be SURE what the test criteria will be. If you don't understand, then don't do it - get someone competent to decide. Careers can be ruined by over zealous application of such rules - eg some organisations will take disciplinary action if staff have detectable alcohol levels which are way under the drink drive limit.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user 
|
I did quite a bit of work at one time for Thames Water and during their induction there was a Drug and Alcohol Test, There were others there that failed the drugs test, One young lad said it was because he was wearing a plaster on his leg?? Yeah Right
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: New forum user
|
I once worked for a large company who ran a number of busy warehouses. They had a mandatory D&A policy for anyone involved in any form of incident. "Popping" a co-codamol was a sure-fire way to get a week's "suspension without prejudice" whilst the samples were sent to the lab for inevitable confirmation as a false-positive banned opiate. It was amazing how the incident rate rocketed the week before half term ... just saying ;-)
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
The issue is with your tester...tighten up on the pre-check questioning will reduce some of it as they should not test if they suspect it will give a false positive. The only caveat to that would be if you need it post accident.
as an aside - I'm a wee bit taken aback with some of the comments here as an IOSH member...'get a union, get a solicitor'...the company is trying to protect both the individual and others around him/her. Seems we want back to the days when
I have stuck by D&A policies for safety critical workers for the last 20 years..one incident when I was being pushed to let a guy start without a full test...he died from an overdose 1 week before the test was due to take place. Funnily enough I have never had a problem sticking to the policy since then...
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Forum user 
|
I can confirm that at my place of work, there have been "non-negative" results due to the consumption of poppy seeds (as mentioned, found particularly on bread). The follow up analysis in the laboratory proved it was not opiates.
It worries me that we find any definite positive results at all, but when we do, we give the folk invovled the chance to give up any bad habits they might have picked up over the years.
Chemical similarities between varieties of poppy will potentially mean that generic test kits will provide "non-negative" results occasionally, but good, in-depth (UKAS accredited) laboratory analysis should be able to distinguish between the good guys and the bad guys.
HTH
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
stevedm wrote:The issue is with your tester...tighten up on the pre-check questioning will reduce some of it as they should not test if they suspect it will give a false positive. The only caveat to that would be if you need it post accident.
as an aside - I'm a wee bit taken aback with some of the comments here as an IOSH member...'get a union, get a solicitor'...the company is trying to protect both the individual and others around him/her. Seems we want back to the days when
I have stuck by D&A policies for safety critical workers for the last 20 years..one incident when I was being pushed to let a guy start without a full test...he died from an overdose 1 week before the test was due to take place. Funnily enough I have never had a problem sticking to the policy since then...
"The" company may well be honest. Many are not. I'm assuming/hoping you are not denying the accused person legal assistance, for which Union membership is ideal? Although, from experience, some employers will do just that. HSE has a reasonable info sheet http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg91.pdfRead and digest.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
Try reading the post and answering that than issuing your own personal insecurities.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
stevedm wrote:Try reading the post and answering that than issuing your own personal insecurities. Try reading it yourself. Then try listening to yourself [selves]. In order for your inadequate drug testing (read cheap) routine to be effective, your employees have to refrain from eating foods that may be tainted with products that may affect the results. They also have to refrain from using commonly available, legal, drugs that may affect the result. If I was the employee, you would be presented with two fingers (and legally). Pay more: Get better results. Union offer free legal assistance in cases just like this. Very effectively.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
Just for information, one common example of a legal drug available over the counter in pharmacies is kaolin & morphine mixture, a cheap, simple and effective preparation for upset stomachs and diarrhoea which has been around since Victorian times. It consists mostly of kaolin, i.e. clay, in solution. Even though the morphine content (as morphine hydrochloride) is very low nowadays, it could still trigger a false positive result during drug testing.
Graham B
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
The list of drugs/food that affect drug tests is long and distinguished Graham.
Even Amoxycillin can cause a false positive. Not if the testing is done properly...but then that means cost increases.
And there's that "here, pass water into that please...no, you cannot go into the toilet, we need to see the sampling is done properly"
Except: females get to do "it" in privacy.
I refused...walked into the loo, peed into the pot, handed it back with comments.
That at a company where the MD was legless most afternoons....
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
Well done John...slow hand clap.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
stevedm wrote:Well done John...slow hand clap.
I have made no secret that I'm always on the employees side. There are no bad employees, only bad management! In the management sphere, I've seen a young lady reduced to tears after her confidential medical details were passed around the office (after all, those details are regarded as management property) (if the law is ignored, which it very regularly is) So, I'll take your sardonic slow hand clap as symptomatic of the poor quality (if any) of English managers (a view shared over most of the EU) (even more so now I suspect)
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
John,
The more I see the more I agree with you
Maybe Steve has limited experience of a range of employers
I'd not waste your time trying to justify yourself
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
My problem with your 'attitude' is one that is unhelpful in this case...I don't see the poster saying the management having not done this or that..yet you insist in carrying out a kangaroo court for their employer...more fool you.
I take it from your example and subsequent comment that you read the daily mail...the information is medical in confidence although management reports can be given from it...
The whole theme here is people and perhaps I include you guys in this who are not sticking to the rules...or not taking the time to understand what the rules are..
To your final point:
Racial prejudice and name calling however you call it has no place on this forum. Again poor show
|
|
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.