I think you will get many polarised views on this subject with those who are client or PC orientated given their preference.

No reasonable request to visit the PC's site should be refused. Indeed, it should be written into the T&Cs so as to avoid any misunderstanding. 24hrs notice should be more than adequate for a client's representative. Now, the contentious issue of unnanounced visits...are these really necessary?

I have worked as a PC (now the client) and there are some individuals I would not be altogether too happy if they just turned up and expected me to drop everything and escort them round site - that's all I'm going to say on this subject.

PC likely to take a jaundiced view of any audit, scheduled or otherwise, if he hasn't previously been made aware of the requirement via Contract award process.

All time and resource intensive and costly for the PC on tight margins.

Originally Posted by: jontyjohnston

I have taken the approach that I will start with scheduled inspections/audits, indeed I will usually send the audit checklist in advance. I am not there to ambush the PC, audit is an assurance tool and I make it clear I want to work with PC to provide assurance regards H&S.

IF I am unhappy with standards I will reserve the right to attend site as required, but never unannouunced. The PC has a fairly onerous responsibility for site safety and that extends to the Clients reps. You need to give them every opportunity to exercise that responsibility. Turning up unannounced, at the wrong time could be risky.

Just my though as Client and PC!

The problem with scheduled inspections and providing checklists is that all they will do is correct the issues before you arrive and when you leave everything will revert back to how it was. This to me holds no merit at all. You will leave thinking everything is fine when in reality it isn't.

It should be written in the contract beforehand that unannounced inspections and audits will take place by the client. If you as the PC are doing your job properly then there should be no problem.

There may well be areas of high risk that are tightly controlled but in principal I do not think the PC can refuse you access, but why do you feel the need to carry out site H&S inspections as a Client?

There appears to be a growing business income of persuading some Clients that they must carry out site inspections! I would only advise a Client to carryout inspections if there are particular aspects of concern and not routinely.

There are occasions where inspections are required but if you end up having to do inspections on a  typical new build then your process of choosing a PC is flawed and probably too price based. If you think about some of the major projects that carry substantial risks it is impossible for the Client to carry out meaningful inspections.

The PC has a duty to monitor and it is industry standard that H&S inspections, by someone not involved in the site management and who is a H&S professional or qualified, are carried out by the PC and reports produced. As a Client you can demand to see these reports however there is certain size of contractor who do not get this!

There is a danger of Client’s H&S inspections concentrating of low level issues being escalated by overzealous inspectors. For example a contractor being asked for proof that he had carried out inspections required under CDM 2015 reg 22 for a 1/2m cut carried out to re-profile a site. This has a counterproductive effect sucking up management time, creating tensions, defecting attention from the higher risk activities etc.

Also are you paying for something the PC should do?

Multiple responsibilities particularly if contractor working at client's operational site.

Put a client into the Sheriff Court back in 1987, along with main contractor and scaffolding subbie after scaffolder fell through fragile rooflight.

Half expecting first corporate culpable homicide case to involve a multi-national. Photo in press would suggest that client didn't do enough to ensure the safety of contractor's personnel on fragile warehouse roof. Yet another fatal on asbestos cement roof.

Having been on both sides of the fence, to me, both types of inspections from a Client advisor are useful. I personally feel any PC refusing an unaanouced visit comes across as something to hide and in the vast majority of my experience no site team is that busy they can't spare someone an hour or so to walk around with. 

Originally Posted by: HSE Chris Wright

Originally Posted by: jontyjohnston

HSE Chris

Interesting statement...

"The problem with scheduled inspections and providing checklists is that all they will do is correct the issues before you arrive".

I would suggest thats a result!

Jonty

it's only a result if they don't revert straight back to old ways once you've left. there is a good reason why the HSE do not call ahead.

I agree with the above. If everybody knows that they are getting an audit on Tuesday, you can almost guarantee that what you see that day is not a true reflection of how the site operates for the rest of the week.

It's like school inspections back in the day. We all knew that they were going to happen weeks, sometimes months in advance. How did the inspectors expect to see how the school really functioned when all they will see is a very well rehearsed snapshot with lots of perfectly turned out kiddies walking in perfect file. It's the same with H&S. Audits should, in my opinion, be unannounced as that's the only way you'll get a true picture of what's happening.

So far as being refused entry to sites, i've not experienced that in the 10 years i've been doing this job and will usually just turn up when i fancy it. I was recently asked for the first time by a client to provide a schedule of visits but this was more to do with them wanting to ensure that they have at least one external audit per week on the project, as opposed to actually caring when i came! They didn't care if it was Monday or Friday, so long as i was there at some point each month.

Having also worked as a PC for several years i also wouldn't see an external H&S auditor arriving on site unannounced as an inconvenince, given that he will be escorted by a person from his own company.

Stern

The legal position is that unless the client makes it a contractual obligation, the PC is under no statutory or common law duty to admit the client to his site.  If the contract states visits must be pre-planned then that is the way it has to be.

I hope this helps.

DJ