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amorris  
#1 Posted : 13 September 2017 20:47:49(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
amorris

Hi all, I am trying to put together a list of generic root causes that the majority of incidents might be attributed to, to enable some trending work to be done. I have done a bit of research and struggled to come up with a conclusive list from a reputable source. Does anyone have anything I can use please? Thanks
Safety Shadow  
#2 Posted : 14 September 2017 07:03:45(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Safety Shadow

Hi, I think this question can be open to subjective answers, as depending on the scenario/incident there could be a range of root causes.

 A good starting point might be little and/or no information, instruction or training along with task, personal and environmental factors. Hope this helps a little.

Roundtuit  
#3 Posted : 14 September 2017 07:18:25(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

What about the 5 M's?

Manpower, Materials, Machines, Methods, Money

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
amorris on 03/10/2017(UTC), amorris on 03/10/2017(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#4 Posted : 14 September 2017 07:18:25(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

What about the 5 M's?

Manpower, Materials, Machines, Methods, Money

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
amorris on 03/10/2017(UTC), amorris on 03/10/2017(UTC)
RayRapp  
#5 Posted : 14 September 2017 07:29:39(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

As a previous poster has suggested, there is a plethora of potential (root) causes which to choose from. Incidentally, I do not use the term 'root cause' because there is not always one, indeed in most cases there are a number of causal factors which contributed to the accident/incident.

As a starter for 10, accident causation is normally divided between Active failure (operator error) and Latent failure (management error) and then subdived into their constituent parts. Prof Jim Reason is the doyen of accident causatio if you wish to research further.

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amorris on 03/10/2017(UTC)
Hsquared14  
#6 Posted : 14 September 2017 08:19:06(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Hsquared14

Roundtuit's 5 Ms are a good starting point and I would add a 6th - Management ie systems failure.  Ray has good advice too because the route to an accident is more branching than linear.  I would start from the other end though, analyse the accidents and draw up a list of root causes based on your findings, you can then see if there are any groups / trends in your data.  Trying to draw up a generic list of root causes first could result in you "force fitting" scenarios to match your list.

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amorris on 03/10/2017(UTC)
A Kurdziel  
#7 Posted : 14 September 2017 09:38:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

God I hate this talk of root causes.

I am lumbered currently with an accident reporting system which has something like 40 root causes, none of which is genuine a root cause.

You could argue there is only one genuine root cause which is a “Failure Of Management” but to make it more interesting I would say that there are 4 root causes:

1.  Failure of the Safe System of Work: someone not either not following instructions (a violation) or following instructions which were wrong (an honest error). Could be down to a poor or non-extant risk assessment process.  Solution: look at the way that these processes are managed and risk assessed.

2. Lack of Competency by employee: employees not trained or understanding what they are doing. Solution:   better training (in its widest sense) and a drive for competency

3. Poor local line management/supervision. Local managers’ not driving H&S forward. They talk the talk but do not walk the walk.

4. Poor H&S culture: lips service is paid to H&S but nobody really cares. H&S is not embedded just treated as a paper exercise.

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lorna on 15/09/2017(UTC)
Ron Hunter  
#8 Posted : 14 September 2017 13:31:08(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

thanks 2 users thanked Ron Hunter for this useful post.
aud on 17/09/2017(UTC), amorris on 03/10/2017(UTC)
RayRapp  
#9 Posted : 14 September 2017 18:37:21(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

Originally Posted by: A Kurdziel Go to Quoted Post

God I hate this talk of root causes.

I am lumbered currently with an accident reporting system which has something like 40 root causes, none of which is genuine a root cause.

You could argue there is only one genuine root cause which is a “Failure Of Management” but to make it more interesting I would say that there are 4 root causes:

1.  Failure of the Safe System of Work: someone not either not following instructions (a violation) or following instructions which were wrong (an honest error). Could be down to a poor or non-extant risk assessment process.  Solution: look at the way that these processes are managed and risk assessed.

2. Lack of Competency by employee: employees not trained or understanding what they are doing. Solution:   better training (in its widest sense) and a drive for competency

3. Poor local line management/supervision. Local managers’ not driving H&S forward. They talk the talk but do not walk the walk.

4. Poor H&S culture: lips service is paid to H&S but nobody really cares. H&S is not embedded just treated as a paper exercise.

There is of course the argument that all of the above are synonymous with a H&S culture.

Some years ago I plagiarised the Byrd/Heinrich pyramid in 3D for a presentation which depicated side two showing Behaviours, Supervision, Leadership and Culture, with side three being Planning, Communications, Unsafe Acts and Unsafe Conditions. Although based on my experiences they purely allegorical just like the Byrd/Heinrich model. 

billstrak  
#10 Posted : 15 September 2017 05:04:33(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
billstrak

You could consider the following:

  • Acts or omissions
  • Conditions
  • Personal Factors
  • Job factors

Also agree with previous posts that for more complex incidents there is very likelk going to be more than one Root Cause. The old school of there can can only be one has long been surpassed.

However it is woth taking the 5 Why approach to simple incidents.... ask up to five questions back from the incient (top event) to come up with your simple root cause. For more complex incidents, the genrally accepted method in the oil and gas industry is to perform a Why Tree investigation where multiple root causes can be identified

hilary  
#11 Posted : 15 September 2017 07:04:35(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
hilary

IMHO a list of root causes or potential root causes is a dangerous path to go down.  We were sent that way by our parent company in using a specific "tool" for this and it was truly hopeless.

The root cause or causes are what they are.  They may not fit into a particular box, they may be quite random and peculiar in nature but trying to fit these into a box will only send you down a pre-destined path which may not, ultimately, help with preventing recurrence.

No two people are alike and, therefore, no two accidents are alike.  Each accident and IP must be looked at individually using your knowledge and tracing back to find the actual root cause however unlikely this might be.  I've never seen a check sheet yet that listed 'depression' or 'suicidal tendencies' as a "root cause" but I'll bet there are quite a number of accidents that have this at the actual root.

Try not to compartmentalise - people are people and they can do extraordinary things that you would never even imagine!

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A Kurdziel on 15/09/2017(UTC)
Sweep  
#12 Posted : 17 September 2017 09:53:16(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Sweep

Can you trend root causes? 

Waz  
#13 Posted : 18 September 2017 09:13:44(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Waz

I use a tool generated when out in the Middle East that I call ICAM - Incident Causation Analysis Methodology, if you want a copy email or pm me, its on PPT and can be printed off to aid your analysis.  It covers both human and work place factors.

Waz

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amorris on 03/10/2017(UTC)
amorris  
#14 Posted : 03 October 2017 20:51:15(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
amorris

Thanks for all the reponses - some interesting points to consider!

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