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andy1963  
#1 Posted : 08 December 2017 08:15:39(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
andy1963

Hi this is my first post so be gentle with me.

This morning I was nearly wiped out by the company pool car as I drove into work. I didn't recognise the driver and have since found out it was the son of a manager, but he is not an employee of the company.

He had used the car to collect an employee (who had been travelling on company business) from the airport the previous evening. 

This may be a simplistic question.

My question is: can anyone, even someone who isn't an employee, drive a pool car on company business?

I'm new to health and safety as a job role and am on an initial 6 month contract at this company. The company is old school and most of the workforce have been here for many years. My worry is that this person may not be covered by insurance to drive the car but this is something that has gone on for years.

​​​​​​​Advice needed. Many thanks

Oliverp1  
#2 Posted : 08 December 2017 08:22:19(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Oliverp1

Do you not have anyway of seeing who is insured to drive? Can you just ask?

andy1963  
#3 Posted : 08 December 2017 08:33:39(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
andy1963

Oliverp1,

I'm in the process of asking the question internally (via email-arse covering lol), but having followed this forum for a while it becomes obvious that the "real world" throws up all kinds of situations and experiences.

I wanted to tap into that experience and not just go into "bull in a china shop" mode, as is my way. 

RayRapp  
#4 Posted : 08 December 2017 08:49:01(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

If the driver of a pool car is not an employee then I think it is fair to assume they will not be covered by company insurance, unless there is a special caveat, which I doubt. He could have his own fully comp insurance which would allow him to drive another vehicle with third party insurance - not much good if he writes off a newish vehicle!

rach108  
#5 Posted : 08 December 2017 08:49:24(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
rach108

Our insurance is 'anyone with the companies permission', but yours may be different. We do driving assessments with drivers though. Nothing in depth, just a journey out with them before we confirm employment, to hopefully prevent what happened in your case.

Roundtuit  
#6 Posted : 08 December 2017 09:00:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

For any operated vehicle the company is liable for it on the road and having provided the key they have given consent to the person driving.

If it is an old school company they probably haven't evolved an authorisation system - licence checks etc. or controls on grey fleet (private cars on company business).

My wife is not an employee where I work but she is covered by the company insurance for the vehicle I drive having been added to the employers authorised drivers list.

For smaller firms some insurers issue mini-fleet policies which may cover immediate family members.

Roundtuit  
#7 Posted : 08 December 2017 09:00:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

For any operated vehicle the company is liable for it on the road and having provided the key they have given consent to the person driving.

If it is an old school company they probably haven't evolved an authorisation system - licence checks etc. or controls on grey fleet (private cars on company business).

My wife is not an employee where I work but she is covered by the company insurance for the vehicle I drive having been added to the employers authorised drivers list.

For smaller firms some insurers issue mini-fleet policies which may cover immediate family members.

andy1963  
#8 Posted : 08 December 2017 09:13:58(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
andy1963

Apparentley our insurance allows for a non employees to be covered under motor insurance providing they have our authority AND we have a copy their driving license. 

​​​​​​​I have been asked to supply details of the incident. I suspect this will rumble on

Hsquared14  
#9 Posted : 08 December 2017 13:38:40(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Hsquared14

Check your fleet insurance.  Generally only employees can drive, they have to be over 21 and to have held a driving licence for a specified period, the period depends on the view of the insurer with regard to the type of vehicle and the nature of the driving work.  Driving licences should be checked annually for points etc.

A Kurdziel  
#10 Posted : 08 December 2017 13:42:03(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

Of course if people can use the “pool car” as a general runabout for trips that are not work related then it becomes a taxable perk.

grim72  
#11 Posted : 11 December 2017 11:16:45(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
grim72

Regardless of who the driver was, it is surely a near miss incident and I'd be more inclined to look into the why's and wherefores for the near miss and to try and find ways to prevent it happening again in the future - mirrors/speed bumps etc might all be worth considering - depending on the layout of the site?

A Kurdziel  
#12 Posted : 11 December 2017 11:31:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

I think that the enforcement issue is : you can set up all of the policies and procedures you want and fit speed bumps etc but if  a non-employee is allowed to drive a company car on site(badly) because he is the boss’s son you are going to find yourself in a heap of trouble.    

Woolf13  
#13 Posted : 11 December 2017 12:43:23(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Woolf13

Your company should have in place a policy and procedure for pool car use. This will include checks on driving licenses, points, fit to drive etc.

You should also have a driver's risk assessment for pool car use which all employees have to take/complete. Those identified as "high" risk from the assessment would either be sent for additional driver training or as per company policy not allowed to drive a pool car until deemed suitable to do so, for example their points may have lapsed etc.

Only company employees should be allowed to drive pool cars and given driving at/for work is one of the biggest risks for the majority of companies from a safety/insurance perspective this should be addressed sooner rather than later.

andy1963  
#14 Posted : 13 December 2017 10:11:07(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
andy1963

Ha! I have been told to wind my neck in.

The Finance Manager who's responsible for the pool car insurance this has told me this is not part of my remit. If I have a personal interest I should raise the issue through the general managers PA.

Contemplating my response at present. 

andy1963  
#15 Posted : 13 December 2017 10:21:48(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
andy1963

Sorry I should have added some context to my previous post.

I did ask the Finance Manager directly if we had proof that authority had been given to the driver in question, and if we had a copy of his driving license.

Am I bad? lol

watcher  
#16 Posted : 13 December 2017 10:44:11(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
watcher

Originally Posted by: andy1963 Go to Quoted Post

Ha! I have been told to wind my neck in.

The Finance Manager who's responsible for the pool car insurance this has told me this is not part of my remit. If I have a personal interest I should raise the issue through the general managers PA.

Contemplating my response at present. 

Isn't she/he right, though?    I know I wouldn't get involved with insurance or pool cars on my site.

andy1963  
#17 Posted : 13 December 2017 10:54:34(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
andy1963

watcher,

I suspect you are right. If it hadn't been the fact that it was a near miss I would never have thought of asking the question. 

I will bite my tongue over the implication that this is a personal matter therefore questioning my professionalism. 

watcher  
#18 Posted : 13 December 2017 11:27:37(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
watcher

Originally Posted by: andy1963 Go to Quoted Post

watcher,

I suspect you are right. If it hadn't been the fact that it was a near miss I would never have thought of asking the question. 

I will bite my tongue over the implication that this is a personal matter therefore questioning my professionalism. 

Yes, I can see where the near miss would highlight this as an issue

I was just really musing.  I think if our Finance Manager was getting involved in something that was my remit I would - politely - tell her that I had it covered, but thanks for her help ;-)

andy1963  
#19 Posted : 13 December 2017 11:43:12(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
andy1963

Watcher,

You are much more diplomatic than I am

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