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Self and Hasty  
#1 Posted : 19 September 2018 09:59:52(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Self and Hasty

Is there a timeframe or time LIMIT for investigations by the HSE, for a serious explosive RIDDOR that didn't result in a death but permenantly significantly disabled an employee that can never work again (three years ago).

The incident and subsequent investigation I've already touched on in this forum, was before my time, but there has been no final word/judgement/outcome and there is a toxic hush-hush lack of transparency around the incident in the company that is causing a lot of negativity and uncertainty with employees at all levels. 

Solicitors have suggested it's likely to be no more than a hefty fine, one that may well put the companies into liquidation and have 80people lose their job, but there has been no word from the HSE, is it worth chasing up? is it advised? 

Do they have a time limit to bring about a case? 

Thanks

Granlund40055  
#2 Posted : 19 September 2018 11:12:01(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Granlund40055

No there is no time limit.  Most H&S cases are triable either way (ie in Magistrates court or Crown Court), so there is no real time limit other than the Human Rights requirement that:

"A defendant is entitled to "trial within a reasonable time" 3 and any undue delay in undertaking a prosecution may lead to the defence arguing that the prosecution is an abuse of process."  Quote taken from HSE website http://www.hse.gov.uk/enforce/enforcementguide/investigation/approving-report.htm#P27_3324

If you look at some of the reported serious cases in the IOSH and other mags some cases can take years to get into court.  It depends on how complex the case is and the amount of evidence that has to be dealt with.  A straightforward case, clear evidence of breach and no obvious defence could take less than a year. 

Your solicitor and senior management will know the circumsatances / complexities and if the solicitors are saying a significant fine is the likely outcome then probably a prosecution is likely.  I assume they are conversant with the HSE's Enforcement Management Model.  This sets out the circumstances when a prosecution is appropriate.

I cannot see a downside to going back to the investigating Inspector after three years and asking what is happening.  Seems a reasonable request.  If they intend to prosecute; it will not make them any more or less inclined to proceed. 

Senior management may already be aware and are not letting on until it comes to court. 

thanks 1 user thanked Granlund40055 for this useful post.
Self and Hasty on 19/09/2018(UTC)
James Robinson  
#3 Posted : 19 September 2018 11:33:47(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
James Robinson

In my distant past as an enforcement officer, I am sorry to say that the type of incident you have described will take the longest time to progress. Putting the paperwork together can take 12 months minimum, the CPS then review it, which can take another 12 months and then the wheels start to turn - simple case 2-3 years. But you have described the injured party as sustaining life changing injuries - normaly before handing over to CPS the injured party needs to have had a period of stability, no more surgery, deterioration in health etc..... some cases can in effect turn into fatalities if the injured party dies as a result of injuries sustained years ago.

So there is no real answer, if you think of the cases that you see in the news going to Court they can be 5yrs plus - the brecon beacon verdict out yesterday 5 years from the event. Civil cases following on even longer - again stability of medical condition

As a note I do not wish to come across as not caring and my full sympathy to all affected.

Second note - be very careful what you say, imply, infer - it has yet to go to court

regards

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Self and Hasty on 19/09/2018(UTC)
peter gotch  
#4 Posted : 19 September 2018 11:47:41(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
peter gotch

Hi Self and Hasty

Sent you a PM.

thanks 1 user thanked peter gotch for this useful post.
Self and Hasty on 19/09/2018(UTC)
Zyggy  
#5 Posted : 19 September 2018 12:01:48(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Zyggy

Some excellent advice/information from previous posters. In a previous employment I had an investigation by the HSE dragging on for several years & I asked for a meeting with the Principal Inspector on a 1:1 basis. I had a good working relationship with the PI & thought very highly of him, but had to warn him that we were viewing the delay as an abuse of process. After a few weeks we received a letter from the HSE that it was not in the public interest to continue. You ask whether you should chase the matter up & my advice is a big "No" for a whole host of reasons.
Self and Hasty  
#6 Posted : 19 September 2018 12:38:55(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Self and Hasty

Originally Posted by: Zyggy Go to Quoted Post
Some excellent advice/information from previous posters. In a previous employment I had an investigation by the HSE dragging on for several years & I asked for a meeting with the Principal Inspector on a 1:1 basis. I had a good working relationship with the PI & thought very highly of him, but had to warn him that we were viewing the delay as an abuse of process. After a few weeks we received a letter from the HSE that it was not in the public interest to continue. You ask whether you should chase the matter up & my advice is a big "No" for a whole host of reasons.

Well that's a mixed message, you say you chased it up and got a positive result but then said don't chase it up? 

I'm not likely to chase it up knowing that there is no time limit on the investigation, I just wanted to clear the air at work of the negative unsaid looming over everybody, to have some transparency for all employees so they know what's going on, what happened, what's going to happen and whether or not they will still have a job!

Thanks. 

Zyggy  
#7 Posted : 19 September 2018 12:50:58(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Zyggy

There were a number of issues related to the HSE investigation that I did not go into too much detail about for a number of reasons. I stand by my advice.
Mark-W  
#8 Posted : 19 September 2018 13:06:32(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Mark-W

I'd of said that shouldn't be any harm in asking for a progress report. Even if they say it's ongoing still. At least you then have an answer to feedback into the company.

People need to rmember the HSE are just people and sometimes if you ask you will get a sensible answer.

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