Welcome Guest! The IOSH forums are a free resource to both members and non-members. Login or register to use them

Postings made by forum users are personal opinions. IOSH is not responsible for the content or accuracy of any of the information contained in forum postings. Please carefully consider any advice you receive.

Notification

Icon
Error

Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
dbrewer  
#1 Posted : 11 December 2019 10:51:30(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
dbrewer

Myself and my colleague are scratching our heads on this one, if someone could help us out?  One of our workers received a scratch to the eyelid from plastic strapping in work.  She was in work for two days after, then went to an optician who prescribed medication as the eyelid was infected.  Unfortunately she then had an allergic reaction to the medication and has been off work for more than 7 days.  I don't believe this is RIDDOR reportable as it is a reaction to the medication not the acccident directly that is causing the absence, but we want to be sure.  Any advice please?

thanks 1 user thanked dbrewer for this useful post.
Kim Hedges on 17/12/2019(UTC)
SJP  
#2 Posted : 11 December 2019 11:18:05(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
SJP

Originally Posted by: dbrewer Go to Quoted Post

Myself and my colleague are scratching our heads on this one, if someone could help us out?  One of our workers received a scratch to the eyelid from plastic strapping in work.  She was in work for two days after, then went to an optician who prescribed medication as the eyelid was infected.  Unfortunately she then had an allergic reaction to the medication and has been off work for more than 7 days.  I don't believe this is RIDDOR reportable as it is a reaction to the medication not the acccident directly that is causing the absence, but we want to be sure.  Any advice please?

I would say no report required as the medication caused the extended absence not the injury as they returned to work within the seven day criteria.

thanks 1 user thanked SJP for this useful post.
dbrewer on 11/12/2019(UTC)
chris42  
#3 Posted : 11 December 2019 11:25:10(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris42

Agree not reportable, time off was not due to the work accident, but reaction to medication.

thanks 1 user thanked chris42 for this useful post.
dbrewer on 11/12/2019(UTC)
peterL  
#4 Posted : 11 December 2019 11:25:57(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
peterL

Definitely not reportable, as treatment is an exception under the regs.

O'Donnell54548  
#5 Posted : 11 December 2019 12:25:13(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
O'Donnell54548

Not sure about the advice to not report. Surely the reaction to the medication would not have happened if they had not injured their eye at work? I think I would report anyway, just to on the safe side.

CptBeaky  
#6 Posted : 11 December 2019 12:44:34(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

I doubt the HSE would want this reporting. However, as I have said in other threads, if in doubt report it. The HSE won't come knocking at your door for a reaction to eye medication. If enough people report incorrectly then maybe they will issue clearer rules.

thanks 1 user thanked CptBeaky for this useful post.
Connor35037 on 12/12/2019(UTC)
Hsquared14  
#7 Posted : 11 December 2019 13:41:25(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Hsquared14

I can categorically state that this is not reportable.  I had a very similar incident with an employee some years ago.  A small grain of paint pigment entered the employee's eye when he rubbed it whilst still wearing his gloves after taking off his goggles.  He went to the local eye hospital who put drops in his eye to disclose any scratches to his cornea and had an allergic reaction.  Sadly the reaction was so bad he ended up virtually blind in the affected eye.  In those days you could ring HSE for advice and I was told that it was an unfortunate medical accident and not reportable under RIDDOR.

thanks 2 users thanked Hsquared14 for this useful post.
dbrewer on 11/12/2019(UTC), SJP on 12/12/2019(UTC)
Zyggy  
#8 Posted : 12 December 2019 08:20:41(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Zyggy

Can I just give a different slant on where giving medication is definitely RIDDOR reportable? For those working in care situations, if somebody is given the wrong medication & then they are taken directly to hospital & then treated, then the HSE would expect a report to be submitted.
Dazzling Puddock  
#9 Posted : 12 December 2019 11:33:20(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Dazzling Puddock

Not reportable.

Never report just to be on the safe side as all you do is show your lack of competence in understanding the regulations.

Roundtuit  
#10 Posted : 12 December 2019 11:41:33(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Given the number of RIDDOR or not on these forums perhaps there are still some core technical competencies for iosh to crack

Roundtuit  
#11 Posted : 12 December 2019 11:41:33(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Given the number of RIDDOR or not on these forums perhaps there are still some core technical competencies for iosh to crack

fairlieg  
#12 Posted : 12 December 2019 12:53:34(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
fairlieg

Not Reportable

14.—(1) Where the injury or death of a person arises out of the conduct of any operation on, or any examination or other medical treatment of, that person (such operation, examination or other treatment being conducted by or under the supervision of a registered medical practitioner or a registered dentist), the requirements of regulations 4, 5, 6(1) and 12(1)(b) do not apply.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/1471/pdfs/uksi_20131471_en.pdf

CptBeaky  
#13 Posted : 12 December 2019 13:02:05(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
CptBeaky

Originally Posted by: Roundtuit Go to Quoted Post

Given the number of RIDDOR or not on these forums perhaps there are still some core technical competencies for iosh to crack

You don't need to be IOSH registered/trained to use this forum. Beyond that I agree that RIDDOR reporting needs a greater emphasise, or failing that the rules easier to navigate/understand.

Maybe a flow chart would be the answer....

Roundtuit  
#14 Posted : 12 December 2019 13:28:26(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Personally I was making reference as to how members of iosh can change their mind between posts or even within the same post when it comes to the topic of RIDDOR.

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
CptBeaky on 12/12/2019(UTC), CptBeaky on 12/12/2019(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#15 Posted : 12 December 2019 13:28:26(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Personally I was making reference as to how members of iosh can change their mind between posts or even within the same post when it comes to the topic of RIDDOR.

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
CptBeaky on 12/12/2019(UTC), CptBeaky on 12/12/2019(UTC)
jwk  
#16 Posted : 12 December 2019 15:54:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jwk

Originally Posted by: fairlieg Go to Quoted Post

Not Reportable

14.—(1) Where the injury or death of a person arises out of the conduct of any operation on, or any examination or other medical treatment of, that person (such operation, examination or other treatment being conducted by or under the supervision of a registered medical practitioner or a registered dentist), the requirements of regulations 4, 5, 6(1) and 12(1)(b) do not apply.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/1471/pdfs/uksi_20131471_en.pdf

I read that to apply where the primary injury is caused by the operation. Does it apply where the primary injury is caused by work and then exacerbated by treatment? The chain of causality goes back to the work injury,

Confused of Clapham,

John

fairlieg  
#17 Posted : 12 December 2019 16:32:57(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
fairlieg

Originally Posted by: jwk Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: fairlieg Go to Quoted Post

Not Reportable

14.—(1) (such operation, examination or other treatment being conducted by or under the supervision of a registered medical practitioner or a registered dentist), the requirements of regulations 4, 5, 6(1) and 12(1)(b) do not apply.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/1471/pdfs/uksi_20131471_en.pdf

I read that to apply where the primary injury is caused by the operation. Does it apply where the primary injury is caused by work and then exacerbated by treatment? The chain of causality goes back to the work injury,

Confused of Clapham,

John

Treatment casued an allergic reaction resulting in lost time.  I dont see where in the regulation it states that there must be a primary injury it says "any examination or other medical treatment".  Take out the verbage that does not apply and it reads

"Where the injury arises out of the conduct of any other medical treatment of, that person"

The cut never caused the infection, bacteria did that (beyond the employers control unless they work in a microbiology lab)

If they had received different treatment not causing a reaction this thread would not exist

jwk  
#18 Posted : 13 December 2019 15:35:08(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jwk

Originally Posted by: fairlieg Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: jwk Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: fairlieg Go to Quoted Post

Not Reportable

14.—(1) (such operation, examination or other treatment being conducted by or under the supervision of a registered medical practitioner or a registered dentist), the requirements of regulations 4, 5, 6(1) and 12(1)(b) do not apply.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/1471/pdfs/uksi_20131471_en.pdf

I read that to apply where the primary injury is caused by the operation. Does it apply where the primary injury is caused by work and then exacerbated by treatment? The chain of causality goes back to the work injury,

Confused of Clapham,

John

Treatment casued an allergic reaction resulting in lost time.  I dont see where in the regulation it states that there must be a primary injury it says "any examination or other medical treatment".  Take out the verbage that does not apply and it reads

"Where the injury arises out of the conduct of any other medical treatment of, that person"

The cut never caused the infection, bacteria did that (beyond the employers control unless they work in a microbiology lab)

If they had received different treatment not causing a reaction this thread would not exist

I think that's my point: 'the injury' arose out of work, and was then exacerbated by treatment. The treatment didn't cause the injury....

RIDDOR, love it to bits,

John

A Kurdziel  
#19 Posted : 13 December 2019 16:28:09(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
A Kurdziel

RIDDOR has nothing to do with causality, liability or blame. It is simply a requirement for employers to report to the HSE work related accidents, whoever’s fault it is.

So you have a work related incident which is described in the legislation you must report it to the HSE.

Yes you could argue that there is chain of causation between the original injury and the person developing the latter injury from medical treatment. This chain might be strong enough for legal action or it might not: this is a very contentious area. Bu this has nothing to do whether it is RIDDOR reportable.

As such this is not RIDDOR reportable.

thanks 1 user thanked A Kurdziel for this useful post.
SJP on 20/12/2019(UTC)
toe  
#20 Posted : 31 December 2019 17:12:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
toe

Originally Posted by: Dazzling Puddock Go to Quoted Post

Not reportable.

Never report just to be on the safe side as all you do is show your lack of competence in understanding the regulations.

RIDDOR is possibly the worst piece of H&S law ever written and I don’t agree with you comment (if I have picked you up correctly).

Not -Reportable, in my opinion. The HSE wouldn’t care anyway.

Users browsing this topic
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.