Hi

Just wondering if anyone has had to deal with the loss of taste COVID symptom and its effect on the outcome of face fit testing

Good point - i am part of a liasion group which has a local HSE rep i will ask the question and get back to you.

Yes, Steve but only if you have the quantitative kit. Most people use half masks  and disposable masks and for those a £200 kit qualitative  is(or was adequate). Now you might have to think about several grands worth of particle counter plus training for the operator plus consumables.   

I have to agree with Steve about Covid being a red herring.  A preliminary to the qualitative fit test is checking that they can taste the thing that you are using, if not the sweet then the bitter.  If they can't taste either, then you can't do the qualitative fit test and will need to arrange the quantitative, or else prevent them from doing the task that requires the RPE. 

It doesn't matter what the reason is they can't taste it.  If they can't taste it, you can't do the qualitative test and have to do the quantitative.  Covid isn't the only reason people may lack a sense of taste, this has always been possible for other reasons.  Covid may make this situation more likely but I don't see how it can change the action when it does happen, unless it's to wait and see if their sense of taste recovers (but meanwhile you would still have to prevent them doing the task that requires the RPE).

If you actually engineer the issue to eliminate any need for cheap disposable RPE then the problem for testing does not present itself.

Originally Posted by: Kate

It doesn't matter what the reason is they can't taste it.  If they can't taste it, you can't do the qualitative test and have to do the quantitative. 

Very good point - it has never been an issue for us in the past - but going forward it may be. I have still asked the question of my liasion group - might be that we can help each other if we find we only have a couple of people in eaxh area that need the quantitave test.

When i took over my current role we were only face fit testing where we used FFP3 mask - i was told FFP2 did not need them "has they did not have the valve!) needless to say we now face fit all masks/repirators where they are idenified by RA as needed. But i agree i think many companies already just issue "universal" masks without undertsanding staff may not have Universal faces.

Now people with small faces that is a real issue. The majority of manufactures produce a small range of  size (in some the range consists of one size :too big!) The assumption of many manufactures seems to be the masks need only to be provided for large blokes with optional jowls. On last night’s “Repair Shop” (it’s so relaxing), a female restorer was wearing a mask which, to me at least,  looked too big for her. You really need to get the users to try out a range of  designs  and you might get one to fit. Otherwise its investing in positive pressure devices again.  Perhaps we should launch a campaign for better PPE for smaller framed people.  

Originally Posted by: A Kurdziel

but  this might end up raising the bar for some businesses, who will just another excuse not to both: they might have invested  £200 for  a qualitative face fit testing kit but the £2000 plus for a quantitative system will be an excuse to do nothing.

I would like to think that it may also spur other organisations to use this as a reason to look again at engineering out the need for the PPE (by engineering out I don’t just mean engineering controls but possibly engineering out the substance or need). Though I suspect I have accidentally put those rose-coloured glasses on again.

I see PPE as an ongoing cost that a company pays for ever, where with a little investment they can save themselves future costs, time and trouble and make things nicer for their employees.

The recent issues have highlighted there is a large number of people who suffer with extreme distress (apparently) from wearing something over their mouth. If they manage to put up with it over their mouth, managed not to cover their nose. Even if this is just “don’t want to” it indicates alternative solutions to RPE should have greater focus.

There are obviously tasks where it possibly can’t be avoided, but I think this is sometimes used as an excuse to take the easy path. The testing of mask wearers may be fine at day and time of test, but I’m less than convinced on a day-to-day basis it really provides the protection it should. I only base this last comment on my own experiences. It sometimes feels like the employer is saying wear this mask you will be fine trust me; would I lead you astray just to make a couple of pounds more.

Chris

The nearest similar thing I can think of was the guidance issued by the HSE(just before lockdown I think) making it clear that  they expected businesses doing welding to look at LEV rather than  RPE  as a control against the risk of fume. The key thing was that that HSE issued guidance backed up by an argument explaining how and why they wanted the switch over to take place. In the short term perhaps they can evaluate  if the long covid   is really an issue or are they too busy do public health inspections in connection with making workplaces “covid safe”?

…or you face fit someone for a particular make and model of mask only to find that they start wearing a completely different type and assume that the face fit process covers every conceivable make and model. They just don’t get it.

I've had all the above... I had a guy fail the sensitivity test, he was taking medication to stop hayfever and nose bleeds and this killed his sense of taste. Unfortunately he only declared this after about an hour of wasted time.

We have a meeting tomorrow to discuss the issue with masks and facial hair as its getting out of control now and 1 person got kicked off site last week for having what I'd class as "teenage bumfluff" on his chin but the site H&S picked it out, others are worse and yet the policy is for clean shaven, as they've been allowed to get away with it its not epidemic.

We could buy positive pressure masks or contribute towards them, but are they likely to wear it for a quick 2 mins of sanding, or a quick repair with a spray can? no...  so back to square one