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achrn  
#1 Posted : 12 May 2022 10:59:20(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
achrn

Here we go again...

Somebody says that the law about Fire Risk Assessments is changing and we need to redo all our fire risk assessments because there is a new standard and only specifically qualified people can undertake a fire risk assessment, so all our existing ones are invalid.  This has put the wind up some of my site managers.

As is usual, when pressed to cite their sources, somebody says they don't have any, and they are just trying to be helpful, and shouldn't you know this already H&S person - you're supposed to be the expert (apparently in everything).

I think this is a garbled re-telling of various Grenfell fallout, notably the fact that in the face of threats of legal action BSI has withdrawn PAS 79-2:2020, and/or Building Safety Bill, possibly crossed with fairly standard requirements that only competent people do stuff.  However, before I dismiss it out of hand, does any of this trigger any recognition among the  many knowledgeable fire people here?

I note that https://www.gov.uk/workp...es/fire-risk-assessments still says "You can do the fire risk assessment yourself with the help of standard fire safety risk assessment guides."

stevedm  
#2 Posted : 12 May 2022 11:21:33(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
stevedm

specialist knowledge on fire safety issues is always a requirement...for owners of multi occupancy buildings they should review thier risk assessments to ensure they include flat entrance doors and external walls... it doesn't mean the existing ones are invalid, just need to be reviewed

Roundtuit  
#3 Posted : 12 May 2022 14:29:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

The changes are part of the imminent Building Safety Bill to which HM Gov have produced Fact Sheets

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/building-safety-bill-factsheets

INCLUDING Amendments to the RFRO

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/building-safety-bill-factsheets/amendments-to-the-regulatory-reform-fire-safety-order-2005-factsheet

Happy reading!

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
Brian Hagyard on 13/05/2022(UTC), Brian Hagyard on 13/05/2022(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#4 Posted : 12 May 2022 14:29:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

The changes are part of the imminent Building Safety Bill to which HM Gov have produced Fact Sheets

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/building-safety-bill-factsheets

INCLUDING Amendments to the RFRO

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/building-safety-bill-factsheets/amendments-to-the-regulatory-reform-fire-safety-order-2005-factsheet

Happy reading!

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
Brian Hagyard on 13/05/2022(UTC), Brian Hagyard on 13/05/2022(UTC)
Brian Hagyard  
#5 Posted : 13 May 2022 06:55:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Brian Hagyard

Originally Posted by: Roundtuit Go to Quoted Post

Happy reading!


Plenty there to keep me occupied RT thanks, but having had a quick scan it still states

"Record their fire risk assessment in full; - Ensure that they do not appoint a person to assist them in making or reviewing a fire risk assessment unless the person is competent"

no where (so far) can i see a specified qualification needed to show compitance? Unless thats hidden in one of the fact sheets i have yet to read

Messey  
#6 Posted : 14 May 2022 00:31:58(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Messey

At present there is no requirement for the person completing the FRA to be competent. However, anyone helping the RP deal with the findings of the FRA must be. 

Competence is defined as:

A person is to be regarded as competent for the purposes of this article where he has sufficient training and experience or knowledge and other qualities to enable him properly to assist in undertaking the preventive and protective measures.

This guidance on choosing a competent person for FRAs might be useful

​​​​​​​https://www.london-fire.gov.uk/media/5496/fsf_guide_october_20.pdf

stevedm  
#7 Posted : 14 May 2022 09:22:08(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
stevedm

Originally Posted by: Messey Go to Quoted Post

At present there is no requirement for the person completing the FRA to be competent. However, anyone helping the RP deal with the findings of the FRA must be. 

You won't find many parts of legislation mandating the competence requirements other that suitable and sufficient training and experience...there is nothing mandating NeBOSH for example or the requirements to have at least a Level 3 qualification to act as a competent person for H&S...plenty of guidance tho'...as a client you should always do your due diligence..that said, however I have come across both registered CMIOSH and MIFE who I woudn't trust with my bathwater based on thier output...the problem is that most of our legialtion gives us a vast range of 'wiggle room' or 'subject to risk assessment' and as we know the quality of that can range significantly.. the lack of quantification of risk in this area is shocking and perhaps a scandal waiting to be revealed...the interview of the Grenfell fire consultant didn't do that profession any favours... currently studing MSc Fire Eng...very slowly :) 
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