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dcpjon  
#1 Posted : 21 June 2024 08:03:52(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
dcpjon

Hi all, 

Quick question, is anyone aware of any useful information in respect of the installation of PV panels on pitched roofs?  Particularly keen to understand if it is a legal requirement for operatives to wear fall restraint harness when working on a roof which has scaffolding/ edge protection installed. 

Thanks 

Atiaku  
#2 Posted : 21 June 2024 09:37:00(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
Atiaku

Yes it is a legal requirement
Kate  
#3 Posted : 21 June 2024 09:52:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Kate

Can you give a reference for this legal requirement?  Which law says this and in what terms?

thanks 1 user thanked Kate for this useful post.
peter gotch on 21/06/2024(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#4 Posted : 21 June 2024 10:09:45(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

https://www.citb.co.uk/media/h1djmrxa/csk-gs001-solar-infomaster.pdf

No comment about harnesses in the CITB guidance

thanks 4 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
peter gotch on 21/06/2024(UTC), dcpjon on 21/06/2024(UTC), peter gotch on 21/06/2024(UTC), dcpjon on 21/06/2024(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#5 Posted : 21 June 2024 10:09:45(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

https://www.citb.co.uk/media/h1djmrxa/csk-gs001-solar-infomaster.pdf

No comment about harnesses in the CITB guidance

thanks 4 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
peter gotch on 21/06/2024(UTC), dcpjon on 21/06/2024(UTC), peter gotch on 21/06/2024(UTC), dcpjon on 21/06/2024(UTC)
dcpjon  
#6 Posted : 21 June 2024 12:28:27(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
dcpjon

Originally Posted by: Roundtuit Go to Quoted Post

https://www.citb.co.uk/media/h1djmrxa/csk-gs001-solar-infomaster.pdf

No comment about harnesses in the CITB guidance


Brilliant, thank you Roundtuit, appreciate you posting a response on this, very useful and much appreciated.

peter gotch  
#7 Posted : 21 June 2024 16:01:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
peter gotch

Hi dcpjon

This is essentially a new variant on an old problem and what is appropriate might vary depending on whether you are looking at the scenario in the here and now, or perhaps with a client/designer eye to life cycle risks.

So, in the here and now it appears that you have full edge protection and you wouldn't expect the Contractors to be using harnesses when on the slopes of the roof UNLESS, possibly, due to fragile components ON the roof.

There might be existing fragile rooflights and it might be that the PV panels meet the general definition of "fragile" now (hope not if to appropriate design) or might become "fragile" in the future - just like many double skinned plastic roof lights were NOT fragile when first installed but became so when weathered and exposed to lots of UV light.

If you have any fragile components then it is time to decide what is reasonably practicable and that depends on how much people will be working near or over those components which is down to a mix of variables, but principally how much of the roof is fragile and how many people will be up there and for how long.

For what appears from your post to be a new installation, then if there are fragile components it is probably reasonably practicable to provide localised edge protection (as illustrated in the CITB document to which Roundtuit has referred) or covers.

However, for future short duration maintenance works then may be such localised protection might not be reasonably practicable and perhaps consideration should be given to fall arrest.

Which then gives the client/designers a headache. To install some permanent "Mansafe" lines or not?

If installed then the configuration needs to be such that someone can be attached to such a line at all times when in proximity of a fragile component - which might mean twin lanyards.

BUT, the bigger issue is the maintenance of the "Mansafe" system - you could end up putting those checking that the system remains fit for purpose at greater risk than those doing other maintenance on the roof.

....and if the client/designer decides NOT to install such a system, the next question is then where someone on the roof would attach to if working near any of the fragile components. 

Ultimately there are numerous IFs, BUTs and MAYBEs so that there is no simple answer to your question.

What does the CDM Health and Safety File (or draft of same) have to say about THIS particular building?

What was said in the Pre Construction Information?

thanks 1 user thanked peter gotch for this useful post.
dcpjon on 24/06/2024(UTC)
dcpjon  
#8 Posted : 24 June 2024 04:54:16(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
dcpjon

Originally Posted by: peter gotch Go to Quoted Post

Hi dcpjon

This is essentially a new variant on an old problem and what is appropriate might vary depending on whether you are looking at the scenario in the here and now, or perhaps with a client/designer eye to life cycle risks.

So, in the here and now it appears that you have full edge protection and you wouldn't expect the Contractors to be using harnesses when on the slopes of the roof UNLESS, possibly, due to fragile components ON the roof.

There might be existing fragile rooflights and it might be that the PV panels meet the general definition of "fragile" now (hope not if to appropriate design) or might become "fragile" in the future - just like many double skinned plastic roof lights were NOT fragile when first installed but became so when weathered and exposed to lots of UV light.

If you have any fragile components then it is time to decide what is reasonably practicable and that depends on how much people will be working near or over those components which is down to a mix of variables, but principally how much of the roof is fragile and how many people will be up there and for how long.

For what appears from your post to be a new installation, then if there are fragile components it is probably reasonably practicable to provide localised edge protection (as illustrated in the CITB document to which Roundtuit has referred) or covers.

However, for future short duration maintenance works then may be such localised protection might not be reasonably practicable and perhaps consideration should be given to fall arrest.

Which then gives the client/designers a headache. To install some permanent "Mansafe" lines or not?

If installed then the configuration needs to be such that someone can be attached to such a line at all times when in proximity of a fragile component - which might mean twin lanyards.

BUT, the bigger issue is the maintenance of the "Mansafe" system - you could end up putting those checking that the system remains fit for purpose at greater risk than those doing other maintenance on the roof.

....and if the client/designer decides NOT to install such a system, the next question is then where someone on the roof would attach to if working near any of the fragile components. 

Ultimately there are numerous IFs, BUTs and MAYBEs so that there is no simple answer to your question.

What does the CDM Health and Safety File (or draft of same) have to say about THIS particular building?

What was said in the Pre Construction Information?


Many thanks for taking the time to respond Peter, very much appreciated.  All very useful points to consider.  

Thanks all and have a great week.

thanks 1 user thanked dcpjon for this useful post.
peter gotch on 24/06/2024(UTC)
ohreally  
#9 Posted : 26 June 2024 22:39:38(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
ohreally

Looking out my window there are dozens of contractor staff carrying out this work atm. I have yet to see a harness/ fall arestor, hard/ bump hats are infrequent and they mostly appear to be wearing trainers. Radion blaring crap all day.

Supervision pops by occasionaly, nothing appears to be said.

This work is for a local authority. 

Roundtuit  
#10 Posted : 13 July 2024 09:36:51(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

drewbinsky REPORTED yet again

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
peter gotch on 13/07/2024(UTC), peter gotch on 13/07/2024(UTC)
Roundtuit  
#11 Posted : 13 July 2024 09:36:51(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

drewbinsky REPORTED yet again

thanks 2 users thanked Roundtuit for this useful post.
peter gotch on 13/07/2024(UTC), peter gotch on 13/07/2024(UTC)
peter gotch  
#12 Posted : 13 July 2024 16:49:26(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
peter gotch

Thanks Roundtuit

I think that perhaps IOSH should give you free Membership "for services to moderation of the IOSH Forums".

May be you could qualify for the super duper category of Companion?

P

Roundtuit  
#13 Posted : 16 July 2024 08:06:46(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Thanks Peter but that would be drifting in to the muddled territory of Nominals

Roundtuit  
#14 Posted : 16 July 2024 08:06:46(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Thanks Peter but that would be drifting in to the muddled territory of Nominals

Palmer20061  
#15 Posted : 17 July 2024 10:48:41(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Palmer20061

The NFRC are a good source of guidance on roof work; their HSGS04 'Fall Protection and Prevention for Working on Pitched Roofs' may help, but there are plenty of other guidance documents they publish too.

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