Rank: Super forum user 
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Looking for clarification please. Would I be correct in thinking that a bona-fide sub-contractor would be responsible for providing their own risk assessments for a job, and that labour only sub-contractors would work from a clients risk assessments?
Many thanks.
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Rank: Super forum user 
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All a bit hypothetical maybe. We don't "work" from a Risk Assessment (essentially a management tool), we work from information and instruction in a competent fashion. The duty in either respect is to ensure competency of employees and appointments, and to provide suitable and sufficient information, instruction and (as appropriate) training?
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Rank: Super forum user
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ron hunter wrote:All a bit hypothetical maybe. We don't "work" from a Risk Assessment (essentially a management tool), we work from information and instruction in a competent fashion. The duty in either respect is to ensure competency of employees and appointments, and to provide suitable and sufficient information, instruction and (as appropriate) training? It appears that I have made my usual mistake of not asking the question correctly. I accept what you say Ron - but where does the initial duty lie in producing a risk assessment?
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Rank: Forum user
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To be fair whoever is conducting the work should be responsible for assessing the risk, plain and simple.
Anyone deemed competent to conduct the work should have an understanding of the hazards and associated risks and be able to demonstrate their knowledge and understanding of the situation.
Remember the risk assessment is their assessment of the risk, not yours, they are the ones likely to be harmed doing the job
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Rank: Forum user
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Hi There
a Bona-fide contractor is defined as someone who takes on a contract for a scope of works, supplies their own materials and equipment and is not under direct supervision of the main contractor. The definition is used in relation to insurance liability and a Bona-fide sub-con would need to have their own insurance in place.
A Labour-only contractor is defined as someone who works for a set rate (hourly/daily) and is paid for their time. They would not supply their own materials or equipment (except for maybe hand tools) and works under direct supervision of the main contractor. A Labour-only sub-con would be covered by the main contractors insurance as they are deemed as an employee in this respect.
Back to your question regarding RA's it would be reasonable to expect a Bona-fide contractor to carry-out the RA as the main contractor does not have the direct control on the 'how' part of the job in hand. Although the main contractor would want to see the RA to sense check suitability.
A labour only contractor I would expect them to be familiar with the RA that the main contractor has carried out for activity they have been brought in to complete under the main contractor control.
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Rank: Super forum user
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For direct labour-only, the person commissioning these people would have responsibility for the R/A etc.
By the same token, I wouldn't want or expect agency staff to be turning up with their own Risk Assessments. That would be confusing!
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Rank: Super forum user
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decimomal wrote:Looking for clarification please. Would I be correct in thinking that a bona-fide sub-contractor would be responsible for providing their own risk assessments for a job, and that labour only sub-contractors would work from a clients risk assessments?
As ron noted, a subby wouldn't 'work from' a risk assessment. As well as risk assessment we should be talking about 'method statement'. A bona-fide sub-contracator should prepare an MS and submit it (with a draft RA) to the client, there should be some discussions and final agreement on any changes to the MS - after all the method might not be feasible if e.g. the proposed equipment was not practical on the site - and once the MS is agreed then the RA is updated to ensure the method can be safe. So it might start off a bona-fide subby's RAMS but should be a joint effort.
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