Rank: Super forum user
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I read with interest the current thread on CDM Co-ordinator, and followed this up with a brief look at the OSHCR list and viewed details of some CDM-C's and then their websites.
I was intrigued by the fact that some CDM-C's operate like a mail-order system, i.e. they ask clients to forward all the relevant data to them and they then notify the project and prepare relevant info for the H&S file.
Here's a typical statement from a CMC-C (CMIOSH, RMaPS) I viewed: "All documentation is done electronically between all parties involved".
So, he never meets the client, nor the principal contractor, nor any of the contractors!
Can a CDM-C really do his job without going on to the site after construction has started?
NOTE: I act as CDM-C for notifiable projects for relatively small local builders, and I usually also act as their safety adviser so for the latter reason I do need to be on site regularly anyway.
But as CDM-C these site visits are useful a) to confirm that I know about all the sub-contractors (some builders have a nasty habit of suddenly employing new sub-contractors without telling me!) and b) for CDM-C surely site visits assist in preparing/updating the H&S file for the client?
Can a CDM-C really do his job without going on to the site?
JohnW
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Rank: Super forum user
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sorry "Here's a typical statement from a CMC-C ..." should read "Here's a typical statement from a CDM-C ..."
Bad form, I know, to reply to one's own initial posting, just to add, another reason CDM-C should visit site is when design changes occur during construction.
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Rank: Forum user
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"All documentation is done electronically between all parties involved", could also mean that the CDM-C in question ensures that everyone has been given electronic versions, of all documentation that is speedily delivered in an easily stored and retrievable format. Sending and receipt of which can be date stamped and verified. They may also get hard copies of the documentation, telephone conversations, face to face meetings and site visits as required, but any documentation irrespective of how it has been delivered in the first place will also be given electronically.
It sounds to me like an efficient way to distribute the documentation as well as saving trees and wear and tear on the postal delivery service.
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Rank: Super forum user
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Roj, well yes, SENDING the communication might be efficient but without meetings how does the CDM-C ensure that recommedations and agreements are followed up?
L144 states "the CDM co-ordinator needs to make sure that there are appropriate systems in place to encourage communication and the sharing of relevant information". Just sending e-emails and the occasional phone call doesn't achieve that.
L144 also states: "They may need to convene special meetings if they are not satisfied there is sufficient co-operation between designers or with other team members, or if adequate regard is not being given to health and safety. It is, however, better for these issues to be addressed in routine project meetings".
As I mentioned above new contractors is a problem if nor informed, pre-construction issues like ground condition or overhead cables might be missed, welfare facilities may not be adequate etc etc., isn't the CDM-C supposed to ENSURE adequate account taken of these issues?
JohnW
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Rank: Forum user
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John, I don't think I am disagreeing about the importance of actually visiting a site or meeting people. The point I was making was that an undertaking given in the shorthand form of an entry on the OSHCR register that a consultant will distribute all documentation to all parties via electronic means does not mean that the CDM-C you quoted is not going to site or that they won't do anything else except send a few emails and make an occasional phone call.
Roj
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Rank: Super forum user
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Thanks Roj, I did read that in your response, so I should look again at the CDM-C sites that I had concern with, and indeed....
I looked again at one of the CDM-C's webpage this morning and he states ".... as such I can gather all the information that I need from the Client's representative by telephone and email without the need to physically visit the site".
My experience with builders is that I can never completely 'take their word for it' in regard to following recommendations/agreements made during the planning stage, in particular the selection of contractors (sticking to those whose competency we have agreed on), also in maintaining the welfare facilities, and also in alerting design changes. I often find out about these changes and instances of non-compliance (without warning) during visits.
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