Welcome Guest! The IOSH forums are a free resource to both members and non-members. Login or register to use them

Postings made by forum users are personal opinions. IOSH is not responsible for the content or accuracy of any of the information contained in forum postings. Please carefully consider any advice you receive.

Notification

Icon
Error

Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
PIKEMAN  
#1 Posted : 03 May 2013 14:59:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
PIKEMAN

I am looking for a database to give typical vibration figures for hand held tools. yes I know that in the real world measured levels will be higher, however I am looking for ball park data to decide if we have a problem or need to go further (we are light users of such things as cordless drills, planers etc). The link on the HSE site is dud (no surprise there)
MAT  
#2 Posted : 03 May 2013 15:31:34(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
MAT

Pikeman wrote:
I am looking for a database to give typical vibration figures for hand held tools. yes I know that in the real world measured levels will be higher, however I am looking for ball park data to decide if we have a problem or need to go further (we are light users of such things as cordless drills, planers etc). The link on the HSE site is dud (no surprise there)



Hi, ACoP L140 gives a few examples in table form http://books.hse.gov.uk/...alogueCode=9780717661251

Also have some good general advice on HSE web page, vibration calculator etc.

MAT
james fleming  
#3 Posted : 03 May 2013 15:32:34(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
james fleming

Pikeman,

You can check the internet for the make and model of tools. For Example, this Bosch power tool here: http://www.bosch-profess...sb-21-2-rct-23290-ocs-p/

You can also use the manufacturers hand book to get the info.

From here you’ll have a starter for ten.
MAT  
#4 Posted : 03 May 2013 15:36:56(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
MAT

Sorry didn't read your full post!

Have a look on the manufacturers website, i know makita has a pdf of all their tools http://www.makitauk.com/index.asp?menu_id=133

MAT
MAT  
#5 Posted : 03 May 2013 15:38:08(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
MAT

james fleming wrote:
Pikeman,

You can check the internet for the make and model of tools. For Example, this Bosch power tool here: http://www.bosch-profess...sb-21-2-rct-23290-ocs-p/

You can also use the manufacturers hand book to get the info.

From here you’ll have a starter for ten.


God i am slow today :-)
SPR  
#6 Posted : 03 May 2013 16:00:07(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
SPR

Pikeman wrote:
I am looking for a database to give typical vibration figures for hand held tools. yes I know that in the real world measured levels will be higher, however I am looking for ball park data to decide if we have a problem or need to go further (we are light users of such things as cordless drills, planers etc). The link on the HSE site is dud (no surprise there)


If you are going to use the manufacturers data for 'real' time usage, the HSE requires you to times x 2.

morton  
#7 Posted : 03 May 2013 16:51:46(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
morton

There is a lot of data on the OPERC site http://www.operc.com/pages/havtecinfo.asp
Registration is free.
james fleming  
#8 Posted : 03 May 2013 19:07:49(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
james fleming

SPR wrote:
Pikeman wrote:
I am looking for a database to give typical vibration figures for hand held tools. yes I know that in the real world measured levels will be higher, however I am looking for ball park data to decide if we have a problem or need to go further (we are light users of such things as cordless drills, planers etc). The link on the HSE site is dud (no surprise there)


If you are going to use the manufacturers data for 'real' time usage, the HSE requires you to times x 2.



SPR, are you sure? I'd like to see a reference to that.
Steve Sedgwick  
#9 Posted : 03 May 2013 19:07:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Steve Sedgwick

As a 1st step it is always useful to try and find the Manufacturers data but if you are unable to do this then try these databases. These will help you to assess the vibration risks.
The databases hold independent vibration measurements of hundreds of tools carried out by leading European Centres of excellence for Occupational Health.

http://www.vibration.db.umu.se/HavSok.aspx?lang=en

http://www.operc.com/havtec/default.asp

Steve


SPR  
#10 Posted : 04 May 2013 21:41:10(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
SPR

james fleming wrote:
SPR wrote:
Pikeman wrote:
I am looking for a database to give typical vibration figures for hand held tools. yes I know that in the real world measured levels will be higher, however I am looking for ball park data to decide if we have a problem or need to go further (we are light users of such things as cordless drills, planers etc). The link on the HSE site is dud (no surprise there)


If you are going to use the manufacturers data for 'real' time usage, the HSE requires you to times x 2.



SPR, are you sure? I'd like to see a reference to that.


I have had enough dealings with the HSE on this subject to know exactly what they want in a management system....and x 2 is a must if you are going to use the manufacturers data, I used 1.5 but that was not good enough.

http://www.hse.gov.uk/vi...mployers/assessrisks.htm

"However, if the only information available to you is the vibration emission declared in the equipment's handbook, it may be safer to double this figure before using it for estimating daily exposures"

And when this statement says 'may be' what they actually mean to say is 'you need to'

stuie  
#11 Posted : 04 May 2013 21:49:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
stuie

I concur with SPR - meeting last week a senior HSE inspector quoted the fact that they expect the manufacturers figures to be doubled. The standard for testing involves measuring the vibration by suspending the tool and measuring the vibration produced - it bears little resemblance to the way that the tools are actually used hence the need to double.
Rob Jones  
#12 Posted : 05 May 2013 08:23:39(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Rob Jones

This document will help you, "decide if we have a problem or need to go further".

http://www.hse.gov.uk/fo...lops/fod/inspect/hav.pdf

Regards
Canopener  
#13 Posted : 05 May 2013 09:08:43(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Canopener

Another glorious morning here in Norfolk.

Regarding the doubling of manufacturers data

While this USED to be the case, it is no longer and hasn’t been for some time. It is interesting that some HSE Inspectors are still ‘peddling’ this one out. The HSE’s own website clarifies the situation quite clearly, as follows:

“.. we have deleted the following sentence from this online version of INDG175 "However, if the only information available to you is the vibration emission declared in the equipment's handbook, it may be safer to double this figure before using it for estimating daily exposures." (this was the final sentence of the second paragraph under 'Estimating exposure'). This sentence has been deleted because manufacturers are now working to new Standard tests written to address the requirements of the Supply of Machinery (Safety) Regulations 2008 implemented on 29 December 2009. These new Standard tests are intended both to facilitate comparison of the vibration emissions of different models of equipment and to be suitable for initial estimates of exposure. You will still need to check with the manufacturer that the vibration emission declared in the instruction manual is representative of your normal use of the equipment.”. Source http://www.hse.gov.uk/vi...ion/hav/publications.htm

You may (or may not) want to challenge your inspector on that basis, or at least direct them to the above. I personally would be inclined to.

The approach I have taken is a rather more ‘cautious’ one when using manufacturers data, that is to (sort of) multiply the data by 1.5 to allow for operational factors, including wear and tear, etc.

It might be of interest to some that I attended a joint HSE/EEF event on vibration and the overall message was that the ACCURATE measurement of vibration, especially ‘field’ measurement was notoriously inaccurate, with consecutive measurements of the same kit with the same kit producing a wide range of results. Of course the same might/would apply to the manufacturers data as well!

My very BRIEF look at the link that Rob has posted doesn't suggest that the data should be doubled, but happy to be corrected on that one.

Crack on!
SPR  
#14 Posted : 05 May 2013 09:16:33(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
SPR

I did challenge the HSE Inspector and she would not move from times two. We had to amend all our risk assessments.....

This was this year too so in my view it is better to go with the 'may be' safer to double this figure.....

Once the inspectors get a sniff they will mot move until your system is their way.....
Users browsing this topic
Guest
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.