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kevkel  
#1 Posted : 12 June 2014 15:07:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
kevkel

I am dumbfounded at the level of fires in fire stations, See link;

http://www.ifsecglobal.com/fires-fire-stations/

Jane Blunt  
#2 Posted : 12 June 2014 15:31:24(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Jane Blunt

Indeed, not to mention the rather embarrasing incident of Essex Fire Service

http://www.firegeezer.co...e-vehicle-shuts-highway/

It just goes to show that fire happens, because people make mistakes and because technology fails.
jwk  
#3 Posted : 12 June 2014 16:25:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jwk

I know fire stations are complex buildings which operate 24 hours a day etc etc, but you couldn't make this one up http://www.dailymail.co....aze-risk-assessment.html

From 2010, for those who haven't seen it before,

John
Borisgiles  
#4 Posted : 12 June 2014 16:39:22(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Borisgiles

jwk wrote:
I know fire stations are complex buildings which operate 24 hours a day etc etc, but you couldn't make this one up http://www.dailymail.co....aze-risk-assessment.html

From 2010, for those who haven't seen it before,

John


That DM headline really annoys me. The fire station did not burn down because there wasn't a risk assessment, it burnt down because there were insufficient controls. Buildings do not spontaneously combust just because there isn't a piece of paper in a fire somewhere with "Fire Risk Assessment" written on it!
jwk  
#5 Posted : 12 June 2014 16:59:56(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jwk

Ah, but Boris, a risk assessment isn't a piece of paper; it's a process from identification through to control and then on to review etc, and in that sense the DM headline is right. Though I wouldn't for a moment think the DM headline writer understands RA....

John
firesafety101  
#6 Posted : 12 June 2014 17:31:42(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

Well I could tell some tales - and I may do one day ;-)
Safety Smurf  
#7 Posted : 13 June 2014 09:31:01(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Safety Smurf

To err is human. Uniforms de-humanise, they were designed to, but it doesn't alter the fact that the peson inside it is still a human and we all make mistakes.

Can any of us here say we have never injured ourselves doing something where we should have known better?
David Bannister  
#8 Posted : 13 June 2014 09:45:36(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
David Bannister

The fact that a fire station has had a a fire is not remarkable, it is the frequency that is surprising, given the occupation.

Maybe it is like builders living in tumbledown houses. a thief in the police station or tailors in threadbare suits. Perhaps the example of dentists all having perfect teeth would be a more appropriate achievement.
firesafety101  
#9 Posted : 13 June 2014 11:12:01(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

Many years ago in Liverpool Fire Brigade, (pre 1974) when the kitchen man was a rider fireman, in an older style fire station, pre war built, and the kitchen was detached from the main station building, the crews returned from a call to find the kitchen "well alight", an expression used when the whole place was on fire.

A pan of chips was inadvertently left unattended when the call came for both appliances to attend a fire.

A main jet was got to work and the fire was dealt with and quite some salvage and cleaning work undertaken.

As has been said, fireman are human beings and the kitchen man obviously forgot what he was cooking when the urgent call out came through.

I would suggest the blame should have been placed at the fire brigade managers who did away with the station cooks.
mssy  
#10 Posted : 13 June 2014 17:49:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
mssy


John


That DM headline really annoys me. The fire station did not burn down because there wasn't a risk assessment, it burnt down because there were insufficient controls. Buildings do not spontaneously combust just because there isn't a piece of paper in a fire somewhere with "Fire Risk Assessment" written on it!


A (regulatory) FRA is a life safety tool with an aim to prevent fires, or if despite best efforts a fire does occur, the systems put in placeby the FRA should ensure the safety of all relevant persons is protected.

A FRA isn't - and never has been - aimed to stop all fires or prevent any building burning down - it is to protect lives.

So did any of these fire station fires cause injuries or deaths? If no, then IMHO they have not failed, but they have just not been fully successful.

I do not see that if a fire occurring in any of the premises I am responsible for as a failure in me or any FRA I have developed. There may be a systemic failure, but its not necessarily going to be the FRA that has failed.

For example, if a competently installed brand new washing machine catches fire and causes severe damage - even a total loss - that cannot automatically be branded as a FRA failure can it? If anyone here thinks a FRA (even the high quality ones that I produce!!) will stop 100% of fires, perhaps they need some CPD :)


gramsay  
#11 Posted : 16 June 2014 13:24:22(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
gramsay

My first callout as a newbie retained firefighter (lunchtime on the day I was to attend my first station night after my training course) was for the business adjacent to the fire station burning down (welding in a very old vehicle repair garage).

I also lived closest to the station (30 secs run down the hill and over the fence) so arrived first, and all in all it was one of those excellent 'learning points' for when things don't go as expected. I didn't know who everyone (in fact, almost anyone) was, our station was smoke logged within minutes of me getting there and people arriving by car parked on top of our hydrant in the smoky car park, which I was sent off to set up (and had trouble finding).

I've always remembered that day as a reminder to think about what could prevent an emergency plan from working. We did ok in the end, prevented the fire from spreading at the cost of a slightly melted fire engine, but it was the classic baptism. My first job after BA qualification was also so equally memorable that they decided to think twice before sending me on courses.
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