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Wareing27472  
#1 Posted : 13 June 2014 19:42:12(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Wareing27472

I am being requested by a client to up date our COSHH assessments, so they reflect the requirements under Reach , we are a service provider for service , engineering. We have started obtaining the latest and sheets for the products we use ensuring they are reach. St present our COSHH assessment is based on HSE essentials, the client requests the assessment now be based on the P and H numbers.

A, as anyone else had this request as a end user. ?

B, Client is quoting this is now law under European regulations?

C, If so any tips, advice ?
Roundtuit  
#2 Posted : 13 June 2014 21:13:42(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Your client is incorrectly describing the regulations. Only chemical substances must have P and H phrases. Mixtures previously called preparations can still be produced with the old format Safety Data Sheet and labelling until 31st May 2015. Even then mixtures already on the market I.e. at the stockist or distributor can still carry the old classification until 31st May 2017. So as a provider it depends where your stockist acquires the products you use and how quickly their stock cycles.

Another point of strong confusion a COSHH assessment is not a Safety Data Sheet - neither is a Safety Data Sheet a COSHH assessment - construction supply companies are the worst offenders for this descriptive error. REACH is about the chemical substance or mixtures thereof not an assessment of their use in the work environment
Roundtuit  
#3 Posted : 13 June 2014 21:13:42(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Your client is incorrectly describing the regulations. Only chemical substances must have P and H phrases. Mixtures previously called preparations can still be produced with the old format Safety Data Sheet and labelling until 31st May 2015. Even then mixtures already on the market I.e. at the stockist or distributor can still carry the old classification until 31st May 2017. So as a provider it depends where your stockist acquires the products you use and how quickly their stock cycles.

Another point of strong confusion a COSHH assessment is not a Safety Data Sheet - neither is a Safety Data Sheet a COSHH assessment - construction supply companies are the worst offenders for this descriptive error. REACH is about the chemical substance or mixtures thereof not an assessment of their use in the work environment
chris.packham  
#4 Posted : 13 June 2014 22:53:23(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
chris.packham

The safety data sheet is only one small element in a risk assessment for COSHH. The safety data sheet only provides limited data on the hazards of the constituents of the chemical product as supplied. This can be very different from the hazards that will exist when the chemical is actually used. The 6th edition of the COSHH ACoP recognises this (at long last). For example paragraph 35 states:
When deciding whether the substances used or produced in the workplace are covered by COSHH, employers should also consider the following:
Different forms of a substance may present different hazards, eg substances may not be hazardous in solid form but may be hazardous when ground into fine powder or dust that can be breathed into the lungs.
Nanoparticles (ie particles less than 100 nanometers) may be more toxic than larger particles of the same chemical substance.
Impurities in a substance can make it more hazardous, eg crystalline silica is often present in minerals which would otherwise present little or no hazard.
Some substances have a fibrous form which may present a potentially serious risk to health if the fibres are of a certain size or shape.
Some substances have a known health effect but the mechanism causing it is unknown, eg certain dusts of textile raw materials cause byssinosis.
Exposure to two or more substances at the same time or one after the other may have an added or synergistic effect.
Epidemiological or other data, eg reports of illness due to new and emerging agents, indicate that a biological agent that does not already appear in The Approved List of biological agents could nevertheless cause a hazard to health.
One-off, emergency situations arising out of the work activity, such as a dangerous chemical reaction or fire, could foreseeably produce a substance hazardous to health.
‘Wet work’ is one of the most frequently and consistently reported causes of irritant occupational contact dermatitis. ‘Wet work’ is the term used to describe tasks involving prolonged or frequent contact with water, particularly in combination with soaps and detergents.
Paragraph 67 states:
“It may be necessary to collect information on the properties and attributes of substances hazardous to health from a variety of sources to fully inform the assessment process.”

Keep in mind that we purchase chemicals to use them and in the process we frequently change their properties (mix, heat, react, contaminate, dilute, oxidise, etc.) and thus change the hazards. It is the hazard that exists when the chemical is used (not what is on the safety data sheet) that is what you need to base your risk assessment on.

So relying upon the safety data sheet will create a significant risk of an invalid risk assessment.
If you need more PM me and I will let you have a document that analyses the issues relating to COSHH.

Chris


John J  
#5 Posted : 14 June 2014 10:18:49(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
John J

I think your client is getting mixed up with the requirements under REACH, CLP and COSHH.

Your obligations under REACH is to ensure your substance or article is used in the way that is registered by the manufacturer. If your not you need to inform them so they can include your use in their registration. You should also include the item on your inventory of chemicals.

Neither of these requirements should affect your supplier unless they are worried that you are using it in a way that is outside its registration (not sure why they would).

REACH shouldn't really affect you as an end user, other than safety data and requirement to supply your exposure scenarios (best done through your COSHH assessments). It's really about your supply chains duties to keep the inventory, ensure its registered and ensure that your usage is recognised.

All that said I have no idea why your client is worried about it.
Wareing27472  
#6 Posted : 14 June 2014 12:18:53(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Wareing27472

I agree with our points put this client wants use to rewrite the assessments giving reference to the P and H codes. Saying that the COSHH Assessment under the guidance are now out of date, as the R and S codes have now replaced.
Roundtuit  
#7 Posted : 14 June 2014 13:49:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Thought I was quite concise but apparently not. If you use a chemical mixture the manufacturer is not legally obliged to classify to CLP ie P and H phrases until 1st June 2015. Therefore you are not guaranteed to receive such information until that time e.g. marking or cutting fluids.

Your clients interpretation is only relevant to pure chemical substances at this moment in time e.g. sodium Chloride.

Even the information you are currently receiving may not be accurate as many Safety Data Sheets are being classified with read across tables R = P. From 1st June 2015 classification can not be conducted with these tables.

When as a formulator I get a belligerent request citing a regulation my first response is to ask they clarify which article or reference they are referring to. Quite surprising how many cite a title with no comprehension of the actual content or requirements. The ECHA timeline for CLP SDS for mixtures has featured frequently in response to customer demands for a REACH SDS with P and H phrases.
Roundtuit  
#8 Posted : 14 June 2014 13:49:55(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Thought I was quite concise but apparently not. If you use a chemical mixture the manufacturer is not legally obliged to classify to CLP ie P and H phrases until 1st June 2015. Therefore you are not guaranteed to receive such information until that time e.g. marking or cutting fluids.

Your clients interpretation is only relevant to pure chemical substances at this moment in time e.g. sodium Chloride.

Even the information you are currently receiving may not be accurate as many Safety Data Sheets are being classified with read across tables R = P. From 1st June 2015 classification can not be conducted with these tables.

When as a formulator I get a belligerent request citing a regulation my first response is to ask they clarify which article or reference they are referring to. Quite surprising how many cite a title with no comprehension of the actual content or requirements. The ECHA timeline for CLP SDS for mixtures has featured frequently in response to customer demands for a REACH SDS with P and H phrases.
jay  
#9 Posted : 16 June 2014 08:43:42(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jay

Even if the SDS for both substances & mixtures is classified as per the "new" system and has the H & P Statements, suppliers MUST ALSO provide classification as per the "old" system until mid-2015.

Therefore anyone will be able to undertake COSHH Assessments using the "old system" if it is based on control banding principle, for example HSE's COSHH Essentials.

jay  
#10 Posted : 16 June 2014 08:54:26(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
jay

There appears to be confusion regarding how REACH, CLP & COSHH are linked.

The requiremement for the 16 Section SDSs' is from REACH, not from CLP, in addition to the Registration, Evaluation and Authorisation.
http://www.hse.gov.uk/reach/resources/reachsds.pdf

CLP is primarily about classification , labelling and packaging--although it has other requirements, such as notification etc.
http://www.hse.gov.uk/ch...legal/clp-regulation.htm
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