Rank: Forum user 
|
Can anyone tell me if the HSE inspectors are going to be expecting scaffolding companies to produce and have on record TG20:13 compliance sheets for all future scaffolds?
thanks in advance.
Allan
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user 
|
Contact NASC would be your best bet
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Forum user
|
Simian Risk will be able to answer this question for you as this is their area of expertise. Google them to get the number.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Forum user
|
I have contacted the NASH about this and am now awaiting a reply.
What are fellow safety professional s opinions on this?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
I believe TG30:13 is a code of practice,which receives the support of the HSE. However as with all codes if you can fulfill the requirements in your own way then that's fine. So if you have your own compliance sheet which covers all the relevant areas then the HSE should accept that as well as the TG20:13 version - It a bit like Scarf tags lots out their which all do the same job.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: New forum user
|
allanwood wrote:Can anyone tell me if the HSE inspectors are going to be expecting scaffolding companies to produce and have on record TG20:13 compliance sheets for all future scaffolds?
thanks in advance.
Allan
They haven't for previous versions so I very much doubt they will now. I'd be interested in how may firms actually bought a copy of TG20:13, sure the bigger companies but the number of SME's that would stump up £1000 has to be limited?
I think that inspectors would check the RAMS for reference to the guide and take it from there.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Forum user
|
TG20-13 compliance sheets do not cover all scaffolds but they could obviously be used for compliance in the event of a scaffold collapse for example. That said so could a design. It would be my recommendation that if scaffold contractors are using tube and fitting scaffold then they should have either a design or a compliance sheet and it would not surprise me if a visiting HSE inspector requested to view either. As for the cost, the software for providing compliance sheets is very good, provides lots of information and a £1000 will be quickly recuperated by the scaffold contractor by saving costs in design.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Forum user
|
So far, I've found very few medium size scaffolding outfits embracing TG20:13 despite referencing it in their RA/MS.
After using the software for a few months they now know which scaffolds need a design and which don't.
The earlier point of "compliance sheet or design" is accurate. There should be one of the above on site and adhered to.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Super forum user
|
As the BS does not refer to Tube and fitting ALL tube and fitting scaffolds have some neeed to match at least the TG 20 requirements. Thus some form of evidence is needed by the contractor if they are to evidence compliance and suitability as a workplace.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: New forum user
|
Could the required evidence not be a hand-over certificate? Unless it is stipulated that compliance sheets or a design needs to be readily available to an inspector the bare minimum will be at hand.
I think the latest TG20 is brilliant and it will save money on bespoke designs, it could be widened to incorporate edge protection, which, in my opinion is an area that is often neglected in terms of design. How many times have you seen joints in the same bay, two few supports for the length of the tube, even standards up to 10m high laying against a building but with no discernible means of staying put?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Forum user
|
TG20:13 has widened the scope of basic scaffolds, or at the very least provided designs on items that were once outside the scope. Bearing in mind we can only believe (or not) what we are told, I'm aware the HSE cannot enforce the requirements of the document, as has already been stated - it is guidance. As an ex-scaffolder it is a shame the industry needs this innovation and drive towards better safety, yet the cost the NASC will have incurred may not be returned sufficiently as take up will be disappointing.
Compliance sheets would never make general H&S Practitioner's over-night experts and experienced scaffolders moving into H&S practise, would undoubtedly create their own inspection sheets, keeping clients interests safe. On the whole, a slightly depressing affair when the purpose is right, but its practical application may never mature. It keeps the money and business among the select few, and little more unfortunately, as good an idea as it is.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: Forum user
|
The Work at Height Regulations require scaffolds shall have strength and stability calculation carried out unless; a note of calculations, covering the structural arrangements contemplated is available; or it is assembled in conformity with a general recognised standard configuration. The 2nd of those is what TG20-13 provides in its software.
The fact that small companies reference to TG20 is referenced but not followed is that you are using inadequate scaffold company coupled with inadequate management. Same could be said for SG4-10.
There is some parameters for edge protection in SG27-09 but I would say that putting compliance to BS EN13374 into the TG20-13 may be a little way off.
Therefore with tube and fitting scaffolds (compliance sheets or design are required to meet the Work at Height Regulations)
Someone mention handover certificate being evidence. A handover certificate is evidence that it has been accepted by the hirer / client but if it doesn't say what design or compliance sheet then nothing more so be careful.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rank: New forum user
|
02567 wrote:The Work at Height Regulations require scaffolds shall have strength and stability calculation carried out unless; a note of calculations, covering the structural arrangements contemplated is available; or it is assembled in conformity with a general recognised standard configuration. The 2nd of those is what TG20-13 provides in its software.
The fact that small companies reference to TG20 is referenced but not followed is that you are using inadequate scaffold company coupled with inadequate management. Same could be said for SG4-10.
There is some parameters for edge protection in SG27-09 but I would say that putting compliance to BS EN13374 into the TG20-13 may be a little way off.
Therefore with tube and fitting scaffolds (compliance sheets or design are required to meet the Work at Height Regulations)
Someone mention handover certificate being evidence. A handover certificate is evidence that it has been accepted by the hirer / client but if it doesn't say what design or compliance sheet then nothing more so be careful.
In my experience handover sheets state that the scaffold complies with the WaHR 2005 along with the loading capacity. Compliance sheets on the other hand describe how a particular class of scaffold should be erected giving the max height, max loading, tie configuration and duty for a specified location, allowable add-ons such as ginny wheels and netting all useful but not mandatory for an inspection.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.