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mikecarr  
#1 Posted : 12 November 2014 13:57:12(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
mikecarr

Hi all We have an 7m christmas tree being installed into our building atrium next month. The contractor who is installing it (they are a re well known company that specialise in installing christmas trees) say they will be using a 7m combination ladder to decorate the tree quoting the usual stuff about trained competnet staff etc etc I have asked if they could use a genie as 7m is a long way to fall off a ladder. (We will pay for it) They replied that it's their company policy that they can use a ladder up to 7m so it wil be fine My question is who is liable if they fall off considering it is there own RAMS they will be working to?
RCN  
#2 Posted : 12 November 2014 14:20:57(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
RCN

To quote the HSE indg455 "Safe use of Ladders and Stepladders": "The law says that ladders can be used for work at height when a risk assessment has shown that using equipment offering a higher level of fall protection is not justified because of the low risk and short duration of use; or there are existing workplace features which cannot be altered. Short duration is not the deciding factor in establishing whether use of a ladder is acceptable or not – you should have first considered the risk. As a guide, if your task would require staying up a leaning ladder or stepladder for more than 30 minutes at a time, it is recommended that you consider alternative equipment. " INDG368 Using contractors clearly states that it is the responsibility of both companies. "Both you and the contractor you use have responsibilities under health and safety law. Everyone needs to take the right precautions to reduce the risks of workplace dangers to employees and the public. Make sure everyone understands the part they need to play in ensuring health and safety." Hence the need to pre-qualify any contractor, if they are not offering a suitable safe system of work then they should not be engaged. I would be in full support of your recommendation for the use of a suitable MEWP in preference to a ladder, as you state its a long way to fall. Even being simplistic about all this, I doubt they will decorate it within 30mins - ok 30 seconds for each decoration - but how many decorations, I personally would count the accumulative time. I would suggest that both parties would be held equally liable, especially as the hazard has been recognised and allowed to proceed as you would have inspected their procedure and safety controls. The insurers will go for anybody and everybody! Good luck.
walker  
#3 Posted : 12 November 2014 15:01:29(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
walker

Forget liability (and yes it will be you who gets nailed) and ask yourself if you want someone poor chap's brains splattered all over the atrium floor. Remind the company who the customer is.
walker  
#4 Posted : 12 November 2014 15:06:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
walker

Was a bit quick with the send button - I'm not really illiterate ;-)
mikecarr  
#5 Posted : 12 November 2014 15:16:14(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
mikecarr

Hi both yes I agree with all of your comments. I have put my reccomendations to the client (the building owners) and my management ( We are the building FM providers). many thanks Mike
firesafety101  
#6 Posted : 12 November 2014 20:29:37(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
firesafety101

Here we go again - Christmas is a time of year when people seem to leave their common sense at home and act carelessly. The task is working at height. There will be a WAH risk assessment That assessment demands looking at safer methods/equipment A 7 metre ladder is not as safe as other equipment. Do the right thing and arrange either something or someone else for the work at height. No worries about liability if you get it right first time.
JYoung  
#7 Posted : 13 November 2014 08:57:28(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
JYoung

The use of a Ladder should be a last resort, all to easy to use them as they are an easy and cheap (sorry cost effective) way of carrying out work at height. Avoid work at height where possible - use work equipment or other measures to prevent falls where work at height cannot be avoided - minimise the distance of the fall if it cannot be prevented e.g. soft landing system, safety nets. Definitely suggest another method of working - small scissor lift/elevated work platform and suggest their company looks at the policy. If they don't play ball find another company that will!
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