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Graham  
#1 Posted : 27 May 2016 14:18:40(UTC)
Rank: Forum user
Graham

At a recent board meeting, our Health and Safety policy was reviewed, as one does. One of our senior board members objected to the idea that safety should be viewed as being of EQUAL importance to financial or organisational probity. It may surprise some here that he wanted it to be of higher importance than those other two concerns. In fact, he said Health and Safety was a value not a goal – yes, he said it not me. In fact, I argued a little that most Health and Safety people try to get Health and Safety to taken as seriously as financial probity. Of course, I lost and now that ‘EQUAL’ phrase has been omitted. I consider this a massive victory, which I thought I’d share with others to remind us that there are employers out there who do care. The next review I’ll be trying for getting ‘Core Value’ in there somewhere…
WatsonD  
#2 Posted : 27 May 2016 14:51:07(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
WatsonD

No mention of a pay rise then?
Graham Bullough  
#3 Posted : 27 May 2016 15:01:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Graham Bullough

Most of us I guess would agree with you that H&S is of equal but not greater importance than good financial and organisational standards. However, if the senior board member was keen to have the change he wanted, you may as well let him be happy with it. That reminds me of an episode from "Fawlty Towers" on TV in which I think Sybil Fawlty described a departing guest as 'a happy customer', and prompted Basil Fawlty to remark "in that case, perhaps we should have him stuffed" or words to that effect. :-) Graham B
toe  
#4 Posted : 27 May 2016 20:14:12(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
toe

You're in business to make money - if you don't make money your not in business. However, you have to make your business safe, involving investing some of the money you make, on safety. Finances are the most important aspect of any business, without money there is no business or investment in safety. I agree, safety is a value not a goal. Nevertheless, try to convince the bean counters that finance is a value and not a goal.
johnmurray  
#5 Posted : 28 May 2016 08:33:42(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
johnmurray

toe wrote:
You're in business to make money - if you don't make money your not in business. However, you have to make your business safe, involving investing some of the money you make, on safety. Finances are the most important aspect of any business, without money there is no business or investment in safety. I agree, safety is a value not a goal. Nevertheless, try to convince the bean counters that finance is a value and not a goal.
If you're not in business, you don't have any employees. They don't then have sickness and/or injury problems related to your business. If there is insistence on finance as a prior concern, over health/safety, then you regard employees health as, basically, of less concern than money. If we had health and safety law based upon "an eye for an eye", we would have a much sharper employer focus upon health and safety. Falls from height, due to employers being more interested in money, would be much rarer if the employer was taken onto the roof, and thrown off it.
Graham Bullough  
#6 Posted : 28 May 2016 11:06:59(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Graham Bullough

johnmurray Your highly radical suggestion for making employers heed their H&S obligations is an interesting one and might provoke some controversy! However, there are probably no MPs at Westminster bold enough to propose a bill to introduce what might be termed the Health & safety (Reciprocal Punishment of Offenders) Regulations 201X !!! :-) Graham B
toe  
#7 Posted : 28 May 2016 16:05:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
toe

Johnmurry I may not have made my post clear. Finances are needed for a business to succeed, pay the wages, bills, materials, equipment, etc. A business cannot succeed without money but it can without safety. So my point........ the most important aspect of any business is money. I am not saying that H&S is not important in any business model, the money that is spent on H&S would mostly be proportionate to the income of the business and based on the risks. And this is why we have the 'reasonable practicable' element of the law.
RayRapp  
#8 Posted : 29 May 2016 20:31:38(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
RayRapp

I have never worked for a company where health and safety is more important than earning a buck, despite many organisations stating otherwise on their all dancing website and literature. I really don't have any issues with this as no profit equals no business. What really gets up my nose is sanctimonious sound bites by organisations who are only interested in safety in order to appease their clients and to win more contracts. I wish they would either call it as it is or grow some...time for a beer me thinks.
Graham Bullough  
#9 Posted : 29 May 2016 23:52:17(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Graham Bullough

RayRapp's comments at #8 prompt me to remark that I wish I could have a pint of beer for every health & safety policy I used to see which included a phrase like "health and safety is our top priority"! Such declarations might look impressive but in reality are far from accurate for all the reasons ably explained by other responders to this thread. Graham B
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