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awalker  
#1 Posted : 17 August 2016 09:07:43(UTC)
Rank: New forum user
awalker

Our employees have been through an e learning module on fire awareness which covers the basic use of fire extinguishers etc, no practical training has been given. We do have fire wardens who have had more in depth and practical training on the use of extinguishers. A small contained fire broke out in a control panel and the operator did not use the extinguisher stating that he had not been trained in their use. The fire was put out without any great damage by a third party, but it could have been worse. A fire risk assessment has been carried out in the area and the correct fire extiguishers are in place. What advice or instructions can we give to our workforce faced with a similar situation.
HSSnail  
#2 Posted : 17 August 2016 09:15:51(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
HSSnail

What does your fire risk assessment say people should do on discovering a fire. Did your employee raise the alarm on discovering the fire? If so sounds like he did the right thing. People should only tackle fires if they feel confident to do so. No matter how small the fire was and no matter what your view of how easy it was to deal with if the staff member did not feel they could deal with it then they should leave it alone. I'm not suggesting that that means everyone needs Fire extinguisher training, but it is useful to try an extinguisher in a controlled environment just so you know what to expect.
Invictus  
#3 Posted : 17 August 2016 09:16:47(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Invictus

It's not a legal requirement to have practical training in the use of extinguishers, however some would say best practice. I don't agree how does standing in a yard with someone with simulator operated by gas give you the necessary skills opposed to watching it on a screen. All your doing is giving them ago it's not even like they are in a realistis situation, oh it does help it lets them find out how loud the CO2 is. Someone will tell me I'm sure
Invictus  
#4 Posted : 17 August 2016 09:21:06(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Invictus

Brian, that was a cross over and not a direct response to your posting I was typing my as you must of been typing yours.
HSSnail  
#5 Posted : 17 August 2016 09:34:00(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
HSSnail

No a problem Invictus, I think we were in basic agreement. Have to say I found "having a go" with different extinguishers useful, as you say the sound of some, and the pressure needed to depress some of the handles was a bit of a surprise. have also tried to use one of the small extinguishers they sell for vehicles - would have had more effect spitting on the fire. But yes I would not consider myself trained as a fire fighter and if anyone told me I should try and put out an office fire I felt uncomfortable with just because I have had a go I think they would be shocked by my response!
kevkel  
#6 Posted : 17 August 2016 16:02:22(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
kevkel

awalker We have moved from all classroom based fire training to online training (in-house) and it has been good so far. I would always have taught the use of fire extinguishers as part of my course and this part remains as an extra session to the online training. All staff in my workplace must be trained in using a fire extinguisher (lot of vulnerable people). Online can be good but I believe a good mix of theory and practical is best. Remember fire training can be a lot of things. there is no correct or incorrect way of doing it as long as the material is sound.
mssy  
#7 Posted : 17 August 2016 19:51:11(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
mssy

awalker wrote:
What advice or instructions can we give to our workforce faced with a similar situation.
It seems to me that if staff are only trained to a 'show & tell' level, it's commensurate with ensuring staff have some idea how to use extinguishers to aid their escape - say if their MOE was blocked by a fire. A responsible person have a blooming nerve if they expect staff with such minimal training to firefight any incident Is a fire in a control panel, with toxic gases and the potential for live electrics, a small & simple fire? I think not This employee appears to have made the decision that he or she was not confident to deal with this incident and walked away. That is exactly how we train our staff! He should be praised and the details of the incident used in staff training as an exemplar of staff firefighting
toe  
#8 Posted : 17 August 2016 22:22:10(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
toe

kevkel wrote:
awalker All staff in my workplace must be trained in using a fire extinguisher (lot of vulnerable people). Online can be good but I believe a good mix of theory and practical is best. Remember fire training can be a lot of things. there is no correct or incorrect way of doing it as long as the material is sound.
Well said. We also have vulnerable people within sleeping accommodation. We train our staff in the safe use of fire extinguishers (and fire blankets) and our refresher training is an e-learning package. Although we train our staff we do-not expect them to fight fires, they can choose to if they think its safe to do so. However, we do expect our staff to safely evacuate the premises and the people within, in the event of an emergency and the FRA dictates this. It is noted that our premises have L1 alarms fitted and hence this approach.
Roundtuit  
#9 Posted : 17 August 2016 22:57:33(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Wholly unrealistic expectation even of your fire wardens. Having started in an industry prone to fires we had a well trained "fire team" who as part of their employment were expected to handle low risk fires to prevent spread whilst the fire bobbies arrived (land rover fire engine, BA sets and training exercises with the local station crews) Most other staff (as you are describing) had hands on extinguisher training ONLY to aid their escape should a route be blocked by fire. It was implicit in their training to get out, stay out and call the brigade out. It was even a dismissible offence for a non fire team member to attempt to tackle any fire based on the thought process if they put themselves in danger then brigade officers would need to do more to rescue them. Nothing more dangerous than the well meaning amature - plenty of examples of lost lives and devastated families due to have a go heroes. So a fire in an electrical cabinet - did they have BA for the noxious fumes from burning cable insulation and other plastic components (look at Section 5 of most SDS and SCBA is recommended)? Could they physically access the seat of fire? Most control panels I have seen are locked to prevent electrocution from intended operation.
Roundtuit  
#10 Posted : 17 August 2016 22:57:33(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Roundtuit

Wholly unrealistic expectation even of your fire wardens. Having started in an industry prone to fires we had a well trained "fire team" who as part of their employment were expected to handle low risk fires to prevent spread whilst the fire bobbies arrived (land rover fire engine, BA sets and training exercises with the local station crews) Most other staff (as you are describing) had hands on extinguisher training ONLY to aid their escape should a route be blocked by fire. It was implicit in their training to get out, stay out and call the brigade out. It was even a dismissible offence for a non fire team member to attempt to tackle any fire based on the thought process if they put themselves in danger then brigade officers would need to do more to rescue them. Nothing more dangerous than the well meaning amature - plenty of examples of lost lives and devastated families due to have a go heroes. So a fire in an electrical cabinet - did they have BA for the noxious fumes from burning cable insulation and other plastic components (look at Section 5 of most SDS and SCBA is recommended)? Could they physically access the seat of fire? Most control panels I have seen are locked to prevent electrocution from intended operation.
Ron Hunter  
#11 Posted : 19 August 2016 16:30:18(UTC)
Rank: Super forum user
Ron Hunter

Sound the Alarm. Close the door. (or vice versa if no break glass in the room) Get out. Inform your Warden/roll call volunteer of the location of the fire (if no auto detection and control panel.)
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